Please Help: UNDER-Whelming Performance from Phonak Roger On iN V2

[Neville]

I tend to default to dual mode, though it’s not the software default you have to switch into it.

@Gene_Arden

But also, she jacked-up (overwrote) the perfectly working PartnerMic program

That’s odd. What else did you ask them to do? If they aren’t careful, changes they make in the other programs can proliferate into the partner mic program.

Was it Costco who set them previously? It would be very quick to roll you back to previous settings if so. Just call and see if you can drop by and have them do that.

Lots of good suggestions here for tweaking the Roger settings. Try to elevate it on the table too, on a cup or napkin holder. But presenter>pointing>table. Depending on the level of noise in the restaurant, table mode might not cut it. But it does sound like there are still adjustments that could be made. Would be useful to know what your audiogram was. Are you open fit? Was there REM?

[PeterH]

@bigaltavista

(4) like all streaming programs, Rogerdirect has a low frequency boost which can result in the perception of more noise when using the Roger microphone. It may benefit you to have them reduce that low frequency boost manually, but reducing the gain on the lower frequency channels for that roger direct program only.

I shall look into this. The Roger ALDs I have do tend to “honk” a bit with mid range.

I’ve done the PRO reports, which show all the gain settings for Autosense elements, and all streaming settings.

When using a “streaming plus mic”, do the aids usually use “calm situation” as the mic element?

Peter

[Gene_Arden]

Thank you for the posted video!

[Don]

They, or whoever made the last change before the bad one, can go back to the latest good settings.

[Gene_Arden]

The PartnerMic is still connected. But the speaker’s voice cuts in and out. Wide swings in both volume and clarity on a second-by-second basis.

I don’t know if there’s an original PartnerMic program to roll-back to. I just self-paired the PartnerMic to my hearing aids. And it was amazing! It just worked. Beautifully, straight out of the box!

And now, it’s an 18 gram object of contempt.

[Bimodal_user]

You’re welcome. Maybe that info will help you:

On the forum there was thread about above:

Phonak Roger - Adaptive Gain vs Easy Gain

I came across this yesterday and after trying to find more info on google, it wasn’t really coming up with anything. Does adaptive gain happen on 02 receivers as that’s what I’ve got? Also what’s the difference between adaptive gain and the easy gain feature? [image]

[Neville]

@Gene_Arden

But the speaker’s voice cuts in and out. Wide swings in both volume and clarity on a second-by-second basis.

Oh that’s odd. Have you tried just reconnecting?

[bigaltavista]

That’s actually a great question which I don’t have a firm answer for.

• RogerDirect programs have the ability for the audiologist to set the microphone on or off, as well as which type of directional mode it is to use when the program is active
• PartnerMic programs however only allow the audiologist to set the microphone on or off.

My assumption is that the PartnerMic program is limited to using an omnidirectional setting for the mic element, which has historically been the default microphone element mode for streaming programs in previous Phonak hearing aid generations.

[Gene_Arden]

@Neville

@Gene_Arden

But the speaker’s voice cuts in and out. Wide swings in both volume and clarity on a second-by-second basis.

Oh that’s odd. Have you tried just reconnecting?

Thank you for suggesting! I just re-paired the PartnerMic with my hearing aids.

I’ll know more after using the PartnerMic again this Sunday in a public speaking venue.

Perhaps that re-pairing will return the PartnerMic to its default settings that worked so well previously.

[WhiteHat]

I have experienced issues with Roger on several times where a number of odd things were happening, the most obvious to me being that the audio went to mono. These were fixed by resetting the Roger and then connecting the hearing aids again like the Roger was new. You press the function button and the connect pairing button together for about 10 seconds. Then after it wakes up again you use the connect button again. I don’t know if this would apply or even how to reset your partner mic, but it might be worth a browse in the manual.

Best wishes.

WH

[Gene_Arden]

Unpairing the PartnerMic appears to be an undocumented feature. Not mentioned in below docs anyway…

However, the following steps worked for me this morning. Perhaps the sequence was mentioned in a YouTube video. I can’t recall the exact source.

1. Turn off PartnerMic
2. While holding down the Pairing Button, turn on the PartnerMic
3. Continue holding the Pairing Button for 10 seconds
4. Previously paired hearing aids are now removed from the PartnerMic

Phonak PartnerMic Technical Data.pdf (449.5 KB)
Phonak PartnerMic User Guide (2022).pdf (3.9 MB)
Phonak PartnerMic Quick setup guide (2019).pdf (588.4 KB)

[1Bluejay]

You got a lot of great suggestions here, and I just want to add that I TOTALLY empathize with your experience. I have TWO (redundant) Roger V2 mics which I was forced to buy cuz I have TWO (redundant) rechargeable Phonak Lumity Life aids. I only get about 15 hrs/day on a single charge, so that’s why I needed the TWO pairs of all this stuff.

Well, flash forward and now I have the Phonak Lumity Life 312 battery aids. I’ve got that paired + connected to the V2 mic and like you, have found on numerous occasions in a variety of environments that the V2 seems to just amplify noise in a crappy sound quality. It DOES indeed help to MUTE the aids and just have the Roger supplying the sound. But! It’s even better to shut the V2 off completely, put it in my purse and put my aids into “Speech in Loud Noise”. Not only that, but without even changing the program on my aids, they do a very good job of muting down the distracting ambient sound and letting me hear speech better.

It’s trial and error. I think a patient and very talented audiologist is KEY to getting the most out of our Phonak aids + accessories. Good luck to you as you implement some suggestions and return to Costco to get things re-set the way you want them. It’s too bad that even as aids become more powerful and improve speech comprehension, they become SO MUCH more complicated to set up and actually use. When to use the mic, when to use a dedicated program. That’s the question!

[Gene_Arden]

Thank you! Given my degree of hearing loss (severe to profound), I really have NO business dinking around with Costco anyway.

Time to find a real AuD and bite the financial bullet, I suppose!

[Bimodal_user]

@Gene_Arden

Time to find a real AuD and bite the financial bullet, I suppose!

I higly recommend Dr Cliff channel on YouTube and HearingUp website to find audiologist in your country.

And… There will be probably announcement of new Phonak platform in 3 days.

[Gene_Arden]

Thank you for the heads-up! I look forward to that announcement.

[PeterH]

@1Bluejay

It’s trial and error. I think a patient and very talented audiologist is KEY to getting the most out of our Phonak aids + accessories.

Very much trial and error. I’m not sure many Audiologists in my country would do anything towards adjusting the fine tuning of a Roger device. Main HAs yes, but not accessories.

Peter

[PeterH]

@1Bluejay

A quick update.

I compared my standard gain levels of my default Music program with the RogerDirect+Mic program. I did this with all 3 sets of hearing aids.

They all compared in a similar way. All gains and MPOs were similar except the bottom 2 or 3 frequencies, which all had much higher MPOs and G levels in the Roger program.

I made a quick effort to reduce those levels to something similar to my Music programme.

I took my Table Mic II to the quiz last night, and the difference was evident. The sound quality improved, it wasn’t as boomy, and I kept it switched on throughout. Before now, I’ve often turned a Roger device off because of its unnatural sound. This may have cured it??

I can understand the bass boost for the streaming programmes, as it is to compensate for sound leakage through domes, and the sound is coming from the receivers, but I can’t understand why it defaults on the Roger programme.

Peter

[1Bluejay]

Thanks for the update! GEEZ, I am envious!

I’m guessing you have some kind of Target software to do this at home? My audi actually tinkered a bit with the Roger (using the same file she uses to adjust my aids!). I guess it is what it is.

The sound quality for TV streaming isn’t as good with my Roger V2 as it is with the old TV Connector, but when I use the Roger V2 out of its cradle for speakerphone calls it’s GOOD. In a noisy restaurant, my own aids in “Speech in Loud Noise” program is the best. I could even tinker with that using myPhonak app.

Funny aside, it appears I “murdered” one of my TWO (redundant) Roger V2s! It had to be completely replaced - no way to repair it! - after I stabbed it to death trying to get it to pair with my rechargeable. Goes to show, that whole cludge of lifting up the belt clip, pressing the pin into the hole, holding the dang thing over your head so you can SEE on the front of the device what state it’s in - even as you lose your grip on the PIN and have to start all over … AH, it’s IMPOSSIBLE! Phonak makes it ridiculously difficult to just PAIR + CONNECT a pair of aids to the Roger V2. It’s an accessory! It shouldn’t be this hard to get the V2 working with a pair of aids.

That’s my rant for the day.

[Bimodal_user]

@1Bluejay

Goes to show, that whole cludge of lifting up the belt clip, pressing the pin into the hole, holding the dang thing over your head so you can SEE on the front of the device what state it’s in - even as you lose your grip on the PIN and have to start all over

Why you use the pin to pair with HAs? Don’t you have a regular pairing button, close to the USB-C connector on your Roger On?

[1Bluejay]

I use the pin cuz it’s the only tool that works to transfer the license that allows Phonak Lumity Life aids to pair with a Roger V2 mic. There is no USB port at all to connect (i.e., get the license onto) these aids. Instead, one has to hold the mic in one’s hands turned upside down, then lift up a belt clip on the back and press the pin into a TINY hole on the underside - very awkward placement! And probably put there on purpose cuz folks were figuring out how to install/transfer the license to more than one pair of aids to a single Roger V2 mic. That’s what Phonak wanted to prevent. They want to sell a SINGLE Roger V2 mic that ONLY works with ONE pair of aids by requiring a separate license for each Roger V2.

For users like me - with actually FOUR pairs of Phonak aids (old to new) they want to force me to buy FOUR Roger V2 mics. Unacceptable.

EDIT: SEE ALL THE BOLD FACE COMMENTS ABOVE My bad! I keep using “pair” when I mean “transfer license”.