Well noted and thanks for the info about the receivers. Yes, i agree i can be quite stubborn when it comes to deciding what i want and perhaps i never gave the audiologist a chance to recommend the right type of hearing aid. I did suggest Oticon Xceed but told her it is old technology so i wouldn’t accept it. I will do a trial and see if H/Aids work. I know i have trust issues.
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Unless you’re using frequency lowering tech in HAs, your WRS is your WRS, with or without aids.
Without aids is how the test is done, using recorded voices and you on headphones and loudness is added as long as you improve comprehension in comparison to previous loudness.
Then you have result of like 70% @ 80 db.
Then aids are fitted (by following best practices, REM based live speech mapping and so on)
Then you redo test like WRS one, I mean, same words, but they’re on speaker in front of you, calibrated (so you have to be at exact distance and so on), and you have your aids on.
Then you have to score same WRS.
That means that your aids are fitted properly.
However, if you hear okish with your old aids, if you hear and understand with your phone, then this stinks on fitter doing bad test to prove you how you’re deaf now, and then they’ll fit you and then your score will be ‘much higher’ so ‘obviously aids help you’, same like when weight loss sessions at first meeting put measuring tape very loosely and then after x treatments they tighten it up so you can SEE how much you’ve lost 
It’s not how it works.
We in general don’t expect or hope to see better WRS results with aids than in original test.
One way it’s possible is by setting up frequency lowering tech in aids (which original test cannot do) and we can then get better results, but such options works only for some losses.
You don’t have WRS of zero if you can comprehend anything.
Also, it’s much easier to manipulate test if the person is speaking it, as opposed to recording.
Also, test has a few second pause between words so that you can repeat, and it can be paused, so, if you felt overwhelmed by test and rush and results, this just stinks on ‘proving’ you how bad you are now and how they’ll “save you” for significant amount of money with new aids.
I’d run away.
I have WRS of 70 IIRC, and that’s bad. And I struggle in all situations (like, dr cliff audio is great, but other youtubers not no matter the gender, lack audio quality messes up things). Yes, it definitely depends on the speaker, however, in recordings - words are pronounced by professional speakers exactly for clarity, so that we can do comparison before and after HA fitting. Yes, no one speaks like that, but that’s not a problem, since point of the test isn’t to prove how bad you understand people, but to measure what sounds you don’t hear at all, how do you work with those you hear, and if aids did do their job.
If you have comprehension when using phone, and phone definitely doesn’t have same loud output as those headphones can send, you don’t have 0 for your WRS.
Whoever says different - is lying to you and is probably trying to cheat you one way or another.
@Blacky Thanks for your insightful and valuable contribution and i will re-read your post too as it was making me anxious. It doesn’t make me feel any better reading your post as i don’t believe the WRS is an accurate test for everyone. It may be partly possible that i was feeling anxious at the moment the headphone test started as i was closing my eyes and trying to relax so i could do my best.When i heard the tone of the electronic voice it was totally unfamiliar i had no understanding of the sentences from the electronic voice even at a loud volume. Absolutely no comprehension whatsoever. Then i started hearing loud background noises as the test progressed and no voice at all. I was at the point of taking the headphones off as it all seemed pointless. It even sounded like an American accent even though my hearing is severe. When the audio opened the booth door and spoke to me i can understand what she was saying to me and when i am close up the receptionist i catch most of what she is saying bearing in mind that i use a hearing amplifier and there was no perspex shield up. I really do believe that unfamiliar voices and different tone of voice and speed of speech gave me no sentence understanding at all. ZERO. I am very puzzled why the headphone volume was loud but no voice understanding of the recorded speech yet as soon as the audio ask me something through the headphones i could comprehend and answer her correctly. It’s not a volume problem evidently but perhaps a tonal problem and not even clarity was a problem with a real person talking. When i have an amplified hearing device i can make out speech quite well close up when it is quite but only in my right ear. Maybe severe/profound loss in one of my ears is the cause of it. I will post my new audiogram results as soon as i pay for the aids. I will need to wear the H/aids for a while to be considered for a cochlear implant evaluation. Yes, i do realise my speech understanding may not be a lot better with hearing aids but i do know it will be better based on currently using a hearing amplifier. I have never worn properly fitted hearing aids before. My dad has profound hearing loss and he bought 2 hearing aids and wore them for 2 years mostly for church before he got dementia. I tried them on after he stopped wearing them and i had no better speech understanding with them on. We seem to have similar hearing loss before he became profound and shortsighted eyesight loss as well as i tried his glasses on once and my eyesight was corrected.
I would hate to be ignored by a robot 
In their white papers and audiology online courses, Oticon describes their understanding of brain hearing. The brain needs a certain quality of signal (clarity) in addition to the quantity (volume) in order to make some sense out of the damaged signal it’s receiving from the HAs.
The HAs are fitted with the view to repairing as much of the damage to the auditory signal that is being sent to the brain as is possible - but the repair is never 100%. The brain is still getting a facsimile of the real sound because of the damage to the hearing apparatus (ears).
It has to learn how to decode the garbled message and to make educated guesses as to what is really meant. This is stressful, anxiety-producing, and frustrating. In the final analysis, there may be no non-invasive (CI) means of restoring the quality of the auditory signal that the brain requires in order to hear.
When I finish this post, I will start digging around to find some links for you…
Try this link
[*Please keep checking this post for updates and additions.]
[Oticon operates a world-renowned research institute in Denmark]
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There, @Deafas! This should be sufficient reading for today. I hope you’ll find the information helpful.
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@Spudgunner Thanks mate. No hurry to go out your way with finding the white papers but that is always appreciated as i enjoy reading articles from research. Brain hearing seems very interesting. My understanding with lack of speech recognition is that the outer hair cells in the cochlear can be damaged to a loss of 70db and be corrected with amplication alone. This is common with noise related hearing loss and the elderly. Once frequency loss is above 70db there is known damage to the inner hair cells of the cochlear which causes loss of speech understanding and auditory nerve decline if hearing loss is left untreated for too long. If there are dead regions in the cochlear which i suspect i have there are not many good inner hair cells remaining causing lack of speech understanding even with hearing aids. This is what i fear the most although i will find out very soon. With vast inner hair cell damage sounds can be amplified but the limited hair cells are also get amplified resulting in distortion. That’s pretty much all i know about the cochlear and auditory nerve damage (auditory deprivation.
Right : this anatomical information is very interesting, although to me these facts don’t tell me much about managing/treating my hearing deficiencies.
I’m hoping that the Oticon papers will perhaps help you to understand your issues in a context that will assist your decision making. (You’re going to be making a lot of them, shortly!)
[BTW, I suspect you’re a very smart, well informed individual. My intrusions into your own research methods are not meant to be condescending: I’m merely trying to help you to wade through all the available information.]
{I’m sorry that the white papers towards which I’m pointing you all have an Oticon bias. There may be Phonakites or Starkegians etc. lurking who can provide links to their own tribe-specific research that may give you a different perspective…}
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I wish i knew how to contribute something useful with your type of hearing loss although you seem to be already well informed and doing really well with the Oticon More 1’s and hope it can stay that way for you in the many years to come. They say that mild/moderate hearing loss is easily rectified with hearing aids and is the most common type of hearing loss. I suspect that the majority of hearing aid companies focus on this market as its more profitable. Like yourself i have severe high frequency loss and i believe this is an ongoing battle with researchers to find better ways to make speech understanding more audible.
As has been the case for others (@cvkemp, @Raudrive, @Blacky, @Volusiano, et al.) I have found that actively retraining my brain hearing by reading and listening to talking books/articles, actively seeking situations I’m having trouble “decoding”, and logging the sounds and situations that I need to discuss with my audiologist are all helpful.
As @Blacky has often admonished: you have to become your own best hearing advocate.]
Thanks for your concern about my situation, but I’m inboard, mate!
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@Blacky and @SpudGunner Thanks for your valuable advice and contributions. You have both given me much food for thought for this week. We are all scattered in countries far away which is fascinating itself. To keep on improving and become more educated is something we all seem to share. @Blacky i fear your words will prove true and hope they don’t in my situation. I will now go and get the fitting for my hearing aids and trust i will keep learning more from each and every one of you and contribute a little myself.
Don’t focus so hard on the WRS test. There is a lot of variability in both the presentation and the results of that test.
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Yeah, all it is really telling you is that it is very difficult for you to make out words, without context, that a guy with a middle American accent is saying at whatever volume it was presented to you. It serves some other functions for the audiologist and also gives some gross information about function, but it’s not really the same as saying that you have 0% speech recognition day-to-day.
Is it really the case that you have never worn hearing aids? You’ve waited quite a long time. Don’t expect miracles when you get them–this may be a bit of a slow journey for you. Think about doing rehab on a leg that has been in a cast for years.
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I have tried a hearing aid at certain times during in my life such as BTE and cic and gave up on them as i have bilateral hearing loss. I have only tried one ear. Only recently i decided to give two hearing amplifiers a try and i had some voice recognition. This has prompted me to try digital hearing aids. With amplifiers i am hearing high frequency tones such as microwave beeps. I have 90db high frequency loss. It may be higher in one ear.
My hearing loss, started out unnoticed for the first twenty something years due to the type of loss I have. I have always had trouble pronouncing certain words, but it never dawned on anyone that t was having a hearing loss issue. When I went into Navy boot camp one of the early test was to see how we did with Morse Code, well I couldn’t tell the difference between the dots and dashes. No one even then didn’t say anything about it, I also had a hearing test while in boot camp and it wasn’t caught. I believe it was all because I had such great low and high frequencies hearing that my loss in the 1500 to 3000 hertz range wasn’t caught. It wasn’t much of a loss but it was enough that I never was able to pronounce certain words correctly to spell them correctly. After a 34 hour flight in the cargo bay of a military cargo jet, I had severe ringing in my ears, that was 1975, and it hasn’t gotten worse or better. My hearing loss was noticing finally in 1977 when I was mustering out of the Navy, but even then it was mentioned only in passing, and I didn’t really realize how bad my hearing loss was to about 2000 when I took a new job as a high tech phone support specialist. And it wasn’t until the late spring of 2005 that I finally got hearing aids. And it wasn’t until about 2007 that I got a new VA Audiologist right out of school that it was suggested that I get speech therapy. That therapist was what woke me up to my real hearing issues.
I am someone that was taught by the Navy to be a troubleshooter, and I have learned the training can be applied to anything that I decide to research and apply myself too. So yes I have troubleshoot my own hearing issues, then worked with my audiologist to help myself as much as possible.
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As far back as i can remember i have always had problems with hearing loss although during the early school years i was only given a BTE for one ear which was of no use when i had moderate/severe bilateral hearing loss so i learnt early to get the school kids to do my homework for me. I became an expert at reading lips so nobody knew i had a hearing loss. In later years when my hearing loss progressed i struggled at university and skipped most lectures as the lecturers were too far away to lip read. Although i finished university i had ongoing problems with finding work. I ended up joining a disability employment agency and the work experience at a real estate office involved using the phone. A phone amplifier was provided but i gave up after finishing a property management course as i could not understand foreign accents on the phone. I was referred to a speech therapist and was told i wasn’t using some consonents in my speech. I applied to join the airforce as an officer in supply and passed the exams although not the hearing test. Later i got work in a vineyard fixing grapevine trellisses outdoors and factory work. I wasn’t fulfilled and knew i had to be proactive in helping myself and not letting anybody help me. It was a truly a lifechanging turn in my life. I discovered amazon books and bought every book i could find on finance including warren buffett, tony robbins, donald trump etc After reading i took action. I bought 2 houses for renovating and started a business with the little money i saved. The stress was enormous for a good 10 years and i did get health issues. I kept reading in my spare time until 3am and then start renovating at 6am everyday while running the online business. Once the business was up and running i started another business while helping a startup company. I was employed part time in the accounts department and helped the director setup the company computer financial system. My hearing loss was always put on a backburner and i never made the time to have it seen to properly. Only in my 20’s i had an ENT tell me there was nothing that can be done for my type of hearing loss. I remember back in the 80’s i attended one of the loudest rock concerts in history. It was a KISS rock concert and i fell asleep for a half hour as i didn’t much sleep the night before. When i came out after the concert i had very loud whistling in my ears that amplified the existing whistling i already had and has never gone away since. I never told anyone in my whole life as i thought everybody had tinnitus and i was used to it since i recognised it as a child. For years in my teens and 20’s i was very angry, anxious and frustrated. Joining martial arts was a great way to unleash my frustrations although i am terribly sorry for the hidings i gave to many of the brown/black belts. I was always promoted to the top of my class not because i was a good student but i felt i had something to prove and that kind of determination astounded myself. In recent years i have retired early and don’t talk about money because that was my sole focus for too long. When the time comes i would like to donate everything to the people of America as they have got me mostly where i am today and i am grateful for such a great country. I am at the stage now where i feel ready and determined to learn all i can about hearing loss.
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It was the young lady Audiologist right out of school that told me; If I didn’t take responsibility to do my part in my hearing issues why should any audiologist do anything but the bare minimum requirements. I took that to heart, and started doing my own research, I took advantage of her fresh out of school knowledge and ask all type of questions, some I am sure she thought was stupid and crazy. I also basically went back to elementary school and worked with the speech therapist. It has paid off for me. I learned if I wanted my Audiologist or my doctors or anyone else for that matter to take me seriously I had to show them I was going to do more than my share of the work to help them to help me. It has made me a better person, it has also made my kids work harder and be so much better than I would have thought possible. My kids are the first in my family to get college degrees, they have gone on to create and own their own businesses. While I never got a degree I still take college classes and have over 500 college credits, in every subject that has ever interested me. I love learning just to learn something new. On average I read and listen to about 100 books a year. My interest is what ever I feel I need to know or find entertaining. I am 73 and haven’t learned everything I want to yet and hopefully will never learn all I want to
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