Upgrading from Phonak Q90 to M90: Changing to more powerful receivers

Hearing Aids
#1

I have a six year old set of Phonak Q90s. I’m replacing them (onlne) with a set of Phonak M90s. My current HAs each have receivers marked 2xS. After looking at my audiogram, the audiologist recommended going with 2xM for the new aids. I went with the recommendation, because I won’t pretend to know what I’m doing in any of this, and I suspect he actually does.

I’m trying to be a little more involved this time around. Can you folks share with me what I should expect with the (I’m assuming) more powerful receivers?

#2

Actually you should notice nothing. The more powerful receivers will give you room to go up on gain if your hearing loss gets worse.

The Marvel aids are a really nice step up from the Quest aids.

#3

You don’t have your audiogram entered so it is hard to say how much you need the M receiver. If your correction has been limited due to the power of the S receiver, then more gain will be available with the M receiver, and you will notice a change. If you are close to the limit of the M receiver, you may even want to consider a P receiver.

#4

I’ve entered my audiogram. I’m new to sharing this info, so didn’t realize that was an option.

#5

This is what your loss looks like on the 4 different powered receivers. You certainly would be better with the M receiver and that seems to be what the software selects automatically. Technically the left ear power requirements drop out of range on the left ear even with the M. The P receiver is a bit better, and you may want to discuss the pros and cons of a P vs a M. Going with a P may save you on the replacement cost of upgrading to a P down the road.

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Since your loss is so steep however the S only comes up short of power at the very highest frequencies. And you may not be hearing them in any case. So, you may not notice any difference with a M or P receiver. And if you are using frequency compression (Sound Recover) these high frequencies could already be shifted lower into the range you can hear and the receiver has enough power to deliver.

Here is what the gain curves look like. I used Power Domes for fitting and it shows significant cutback in the high frequency gains to avoid feedback. You should investigate custom molds to get the best feedback protection. In fact you may get more out of custom molds than out of a more powerful receiver.

The software also suggests using SoundRecover to shift frequencies down. That probably would be a good idea too. Not sure what the capabilities of your current aids are, but overall you should net some gains with the newer technology like SoundRecover2.

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#6

Are you aware that Costco is selling essentially the same aids as these under their Kirkland Signature 9.0 name? $1500 a pair.

#7

I was not aware of that. Actually, I only just recently began to understand what’s going on with Costco selling.

That said, I bought mine on eBay for a total of $2,548, and they’re already paid for. While it would have been great to save another $1000, I was pretty happy to find them at that price. Now my challenge will be to find an audiologist in the DFW area that’s willing to service them on a pay-per-visit basis.

I got my current HAs when my company insurance covered them. I was shocked at the price back then, even though I wasn’t having to pay it myself. New company, and different insurance that doesn’t cover HAs (except for kids), so this change is totally out of pocket.

I’ve been badly non-compliant on wearing my HAs. I have a tendency to pull them out when I’m using bluetooth headsets or earbuds, then forgetting where I put them. Once one of our dogs found them, and chewed one enough that I had to replace the receiver. Plus it took me a week to figure out where he put them!

I recently told my wife I would start doing better about wearing them. She hear’s “huh” a lot, and I constantly have to shift so she’s on my right so I can hear her. Mentioning HAs on Facebook brought a ton of advertisements, and I noticed that Phonak had new HAs that would work with my android phones, so I decided to make the jump. My audiologist couldn’t touch them at the price I found online, but that was just too much of a price difference for me to pay out of pocket, so I bought online.

Thank you very much for the information you provided. As I said, I’ve been less involved than I should have, and plan on getting more up to speed. It’s amazing how you feel more need for involvement when you’re paying for them out of pocket.

#8

After reading one of your comments in another thread, I think I may have done the right thing buying the Phonak instead of the Kirkland. I have tinnitus and hopefully that feature on the Phonak will help.

#9

For what it’s worth, I think the current Marvel M receivers have the same max power output (MPO) as previous S receivers. (This is based on the previous Venture line, somewhat more recent than Quest.) The previous available receivers were S (MPO 114 dB SPL), xP, and xSP. The current lineup is S (MPO 111), M (MPO 114), P, and UP. In sum, the old S and the new M have the same MPO.

#10

Based on my experience, I’d say that the custom molds would have to have less than 2 mm venting to provide better feedback protection than Power Domes. My current molds have 2 mm venting, although I can reduce that with plugs. Subjectively, the 2 mm venting is definitely less occlusive than the Power Domes were, based on own voice and other indications.

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P.S. the purple shading in the upper frequency range is because I specified allowing 5 dB excursion over the feedback threshold. So the actual threshold is the lower edge of the purple shading. The allowance doesn’t turn out to be relevant with this (APD) fitting formula.

#11

I try to upgrade from Phonak Bolero V70-P (custom earmold with 1mm vent) to Audeo M90 13T with P receiver with custom earmold with no venting (my conscious choice due to make directionality and noise reduction maximally effective).
My own voice in occluded state is no problem, the only thing I have with sound when I eating).

I have a problem - when I listen the lecturer it works really great - very crisp even at distance, which was real problem earlier. But when I have to hear unexpected calls for me, e. g. when I sit sideways to someone - I have bigger problem than in my older HA (both in automatic programme).

What is the problem? Maybe slow swithing profiles within AutoOS 3.0 programme? I have also bigger problem with hearing my colleagues in gym than in older HA which I expected impossible with newer Marvel HA and occluded earmold.

#12

Have you considered a CROS configuration where the hearing aid in the left ear sends the signal to the right ear?

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#13

Yes, I consider BiCROS, especially for autoStereoZoom feature, but Phonak haven’t annouced it for Marvels yet :wink:

#14

Perhaps try another brand? I believe Signia has high tech wireless ear to ear communication that enables CROS.

#15

No, I’d prefer to wait for Phonak BiCros, notably I have Phonak Roger Select. I think my problems result from suboptimal settings.

#16

The directionality of the Marvels is outstanding compared to many other aids. Excellent ability to pick up speech directly in front of you. Your complaints about not hearing people to the side is this directionality.

Maybe a manual program that doesn’t have the zoom enabled would help you in these situations.

I am considering moving from the Audeo Belong aids to the Marvel aids now. Trialed the KS9 aids and they were very nice so the Marvel aids are desirable to me now.

#17

It seems to me that true directionality is not possible when you can only hear in one ear. Hearing aids produce directionality based on being able to selectively mix input from four different microphones, two on each hearing aid. In a CROS configuration it is also not really possible to restore directionality because all the sound from both sides goes to the one good ear. It can help eliminate a dead spot in hearing on the bad ear side, but I suspect not restore directionality. I have an acquaintance that has no hearing in one ear. If you want to have a conversation with him you have to be on his good side.

#18

You may be right - I going to try the manual program “Speech in 360 deg.”

Yes, but simply turning the microphone to more omnidirectional in MyPhonak App doesn’t improve my experience… It must be also other things to adjust…

Good luck with testing Marvels! :slight_smile:

#19

You may want to start a new thread for your concerns. Your hearing loss is very different.
My response was for the OP.

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#20

It is possible, because every HA has two microphones which is enough to make directionality, but it is of course less precise/directional compared to four-microphone system (two microphones for each ear).

You mean maybe the location of the sound? It is other thing than directionality. Additional mics in CROS can make narrower space (conus-shaped) from they take the desired sound. This improves directionality. In Phonak it have the name “AutoStereoZoom”.

Yes it is also easier for me, to be “on good side”, but it isn’t impossible for me to talk with someone in reverse situation especially in calmer background.