What do you mean?
feedback cancellation affects speech clarity?
Is it true?
Just check the HPR
I was surprise Starkey dont have
1- adaptative directionality (Im not saying multiband)
2- VC learning!
3- their bandwith is narrow the new IQ has less than 7,000hz bandwith
You are speacking tehcnical :D.
Could you please explin this bandwith thing and its effect?
the trend calls for more bandwith, it provides speech and spacial cues and music appreciation. It is true that dispensers or audis DO NOT test beyond 8000hz. Moore and Tan have I think a couple of papers out there.
Currently most players do support higher bandwith, Oticon, Bernafon, Siemens, Rexton and widex (with bandwith up to 12,000hz). A notable exception is Phonak, because they use sound recover having large bandwith does not really make sense.
What if the soundrecover is not active?
It is interesting to see all the different opinions on here. I have been wearing Starkey for about 15 years and been happy (Destiny and the non Iq S Series were horrible however) given what I need. I lost my right ear when I was 9 and had a big loss in my left at the same time. I need a lot of power to say the least. I am also a musician so clarity and a natural sound are more than crucial. So far the IQ has been really good. It has a bit of a warble on voices sometimes which I think has to do with the feedback cancelation circuit. Going in for some tweaks this Wednesday. I am using the third channel for music and it is actually pretty good. Sounds a lot like my trusty Sequel. the first channel is much louder than what I am used to but in a good way. I can hear so much more. Anyone have thoughts on the warble I am getting?
To be honest, I am not against Starkey and have to admit they make good aids with very good quality;however, they give their aids so much fame that they don’t deserve it. The IQ , for example, it a new technology which enables you to hear in noise better. From my expereince, it is not a good thing. maybe it is better than other aids, but not as they describe it.
Nothing against starkey- some of the products are of good quality- but there are some claims- “We have unlock the nano technology”, we have the best technology out there seem to be unfair
Exactly.
what is nfusion and nano technology??
they just give names that seem to be meaningless
There are a number of papers discussing the “extended bandwidth” of modern hearing aids. Most manufacturers use similar receivers (speakers) and most can make similar claims about what hearing aids can do under test settings. These settings and claims do not reflect the performance of the actual hearing aids in patient ears.
For instance, Aahz and Moore (2007) suggest that approximately 36 dB of insertion gain is required to provide audibility for a moderate hearing loss at 10,000 Hz.
Unfortunately, this is something that today’s hearing aids will not provide. In general, the odds of amplifying speech into the appropriate range beyond 7,000 Hz are very low.
Moore had a paper not long ago where he concluded that musical appreciation IS significantly enhance with extended bandwith. Mead killion I think had something
many many years ago if I do not recall. This is perhaps why manf. are putting large bandwith.
How do you define adaptive directionality? They have ‘dynamic directionality’ which just means that it goes into full directional rather than moving or directing to where the speech is. Adaptive is not proven in real world situations. If you live in an anechoic chamber where sounds won’t reflect off of other surfaces the theory can work. However, we don’t live in anechoic chambers.
VC learning imo is a bad idea. I’ve had to readjust hearing aids because patients have made mistakes and they don’t like their vc settings from ‘data learning.’ Not to say that it won’t work for some though.
How much bandwidth do we need? For music based on the studies it may come in handy but speech does not even fall past that. The more bandwidth, the more people think that they sound like they’re talking into a microphone. People do want to appreciate music though, and in that case, when hearing aids can duplicate that, more bandwidth may work well.
It is rather interesting that you do not endorse Multiband directionality, However
Dr Fabry -one of the brightest mind out there- who happends to be audiosync director (aka Starkey) had wrote a article in the HR where he concluded that
" Broadband and multi-band adaptive response directional microphone instruments provide improved speech recognition for conditions when one or two independent noise sources are present and are spatially dynamic".
Im sure Know Dr Fabry thinks multiband directionality no longer works because starkey
instrument does not have it
Do you have a link to the entire article? I would like to see the entire thing.
That may be true for one aspect…but what are other positives and negatives to adaptive directionality?
This is way back when Dr Fabry worked for Phonak - this is HR 2005 april. The point of this
is not to discredit Starkey, but to simply state that while they are a good company and sure have fine products, they are not the most advance. It is not true that only because they have it is evidence based. I have personally met Dr Fabry, while he did dispute
wireless instruments he did finally admit- that wireless streaming and VC coordination where an advantage. Currently this are not on starkey instrument, therefore starkey
is in fact lacking of many features. Sure they will come soon with something, but most companies are going into a second generation wireless, Lets hope they could catch up
and raise the bar
You need to log on 60hrs in order for VC learning to work. The chances for it to get it wrong are slim. Remember, Phonak had VC learning a long long time ago with the Savia if Im not mistaken. The new GN instruments have a nice way for you to fine tune VC.
Provided you find the right candidate, The unitron YUU and pasport are really trainable instruments, not only you can train for VC but also you can tweak the instruments to
provide more clarity or more confort. They work very well.
Siemens is also having now a trainable frequency response aids, I dont fit siemens so
I can tell you details about this.
The point of this, Trainable HI should be part of any high end instrument, it is an industry standart. Probably starkey will have in a future. If im not mistaken,
this is something develop by NAL so you know it is evidence base.
Broadly speaking the multi-band directional instruments with the adaptive directionality can beamform on specific speech sources in an environment while creating nulls at various noise sources. If it’s done properly, it’s also possible to rotate the speech/noise around the wearer and get the aid to track them while maintaining the SNR levels.
Negatively the dominant speech in the room might not be the one you want to hear.
In all honesty Starkey may be paying Gus Mueller to go around the World in an attempt to shore up support for their products, but they are way behind the curve in terms of the technology. Put another way if you subscribe to a technology ‘ranking’ they currently sit somewhere behind Bernafon and Unitron. Also IMHO, their current market share is mainly a legacy from their early ITE success and dispensers being unwilling to change to new products. AND dealing with feedback shouldn’t be major positive for a product, it should be par for the course.
If you want to take something back to corporate, tell the R+D people to go away and ‘Invent’ something rather than just ‘innovating’. If you’d spent the cash on that instead of all the light shows and dancing girls you’d have a viable product and proper market share. (It’s called a ‘strategy’ BTW)
But clearly dealing with feedback ISNT par for the course, even for most high end instruments. Thats why people sing the praises of their feedback management. I agree with the technology (wireless) aspects being behind. But for most patients, wireless connectivity isnt what they are looking for. They are looking for a HI that helps them hear and doesnt squeal all the time.
People who crave or need wireless technology obviously choose another product line. But wireless technology isnt a must have for many people.
dr. amy
It is true that most people are not seeking for a wireless solution, but the TV solution
with a wireless enable product is a very very popular solution now a days. Im looking forward to see how the GN alera would work. They are surely raising the bar!
And the IRIS by Starkey. Conveniently being released at the same time :rolleyes:
I love the slick design of Resounds Live RIE!
dr. amy