Signia Motion SP primax 7px versus Phonak Naída B90-UP

after doing more research I don’t think that signia makes a hearing aid as powerful as the Phonak Naida B. I may also consider the oticon xceed.

Regarding REM, how big is the microphone that goes in before the ear mold. The last time an audiologist tried to make an ear mold for her — three tries — there was so much feedback I began making her molds using earplugs that work much better. But I also make them so the tube comes very close to the eardrum which greatly helps her.

I wonder if there’s room for a microphone between this custom mold and the eardrum. and right now she’s at maximum volume anyway so I wonder if REM would really make any difference.

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Check his web, he listed some clinics which do best practice fitting, including rem and other tests

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The microphones are really tiny. They’re a skinny little tube. Think like a piece of thread. At least the ones my audiologist uses. They’re meant to be used with any kind of hearing aid configuration.

Does the audiologist have her prop her mouth open with a foam block when they make the molds?

I already did. None are near me.

she didn’t the last time we tried. I suppose we can try again with the new audiologist — at a cost of $100 or more. There’s also a kit online you can make your own for about $20. But the trouble seems that they are all made of silicone which is not flexible enough for changing positions, which the earplugs are.

That’s the whole point of the mouth prop; you’re making an earmold that suits the worst case / biggest condition of the ear canal size. And the tissues are flexible enough that it works for the smallest condition as well.

I have a profound hearing loss with 20 percent speech comprehension and tomorrow I will be purchasing 2 naida marvels. Take that for what it’s worth. Considering the complexity of these aids and the cost there’s no way I would even consider programing them myself let alone programming them for someone else. If you don’t trust your audiologist then find one you do. I’m not going to get into why you would be programming someone else’s aids. To each his own. And I’m not going to say the phonak aids will help your wife. Only she can tell you that. But considering the severity of her loss and my loss I wouldn’t let anyone but a professional mess with them. There’s already a program available for the user to tweek things if necessary.

I got this message from Phonak two weeks ago:Good afternoon, Phil-
Thank you for contacting Phonak with your inquiry. We are committed to launching a Naída UP with the latest connectivity benefits including RogerDirect, and can confirm it is in development; however this is going to require more time, and we do not anticipate having a UP device in the Marvel family.

If you are getting a marvel yours will be a SP. Since your loss is not as profound as my wife’s perhaps that will be adequate.

If you read my previous post you will see I’m just making minor tweaks on what the audiologist initially programmed, and screwed up. Did you read them? We’ve seen four different audiologists at two practices and they all seem equally incompetent.

Do you have a link to the program for tweaking things if necessary?I never heard of that for the Naida Q.

I’ve just made three more tweaks in the last week. When she tells me she likes what I did we keep it. She says no I change it.

When I stick my finger in my ear and open and close my mouth I can feel an outer part of the canal get larger but an inner part gets smaller. And the shape changes also. what I have made for her is working well at the moment and it gets the tube closer to her eardrum than the mold the audiologist made. But thanks for the comment — we may inquire about that in the future.

Your wife may want to consider this cochlear implants. Since the sp naida marvels just came out I wouldn’t hold my breath waiting for a up naida like phonak said. No audi will program an aid correctly on the first visit. There has to be give and take between the audi and the patient to further program an aid. The test results are only a starting point when it comes to programing gearing aids. And with such a profound loss there’s no hearing aid out there that is going to correct that loss. But then again hearing aids correct nothing, they just try to help. And you can take manufacturers claims as to what their hearing aids do with a grain of salt.


How the joints move is different from person to person so it’s still worth checking out.

Also, I can’t help but feel going back to your first post that you should be seeking a different audiologist. You shouldn’t be seeing a doctor you don’t trust. You should also make sure this isn’t a you issue; does your wife have a voice in all this? Does SHE not trust the audiologist too? Or is she deferring to you?

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Yes, in the very near future I will be actively searching for a new audiologist, hopefully one that our insurance will pay for and who does REM. REM is probably the biggest issue. If they don’t do that they probably are deficient in other ways also… As I’ve written we’ve seen 4 at two different practices and all of them were deficient. How my wife hears is the biggest issue. When she tells me she doesn’t hear well, after seeing the audiologist, I do what I can to improve that. Obviously she’s not happy with any of them. But she hates computers, and she can’t hear on the telephone, so it’s up to me to try to figure out what’s best.

I have written above about why she doesn’t want cochlear implants. (on one of Dr. Cliff Olson’s videos he mentions that there’s been new research into making cochlear hairs regrow — might be available in five years. She 75 now, and if she lives long enough maybe they’ll be complete breakthroughs.) We will most likely go with the Phonak Naida B. She’s been with hearing aids for 40 years or more so she knows very well their limitations.

I tried the naida b but didn’t like them. Too much background suppression but that’s me. I preferred the naida marvels instead because they were more natural sounding and had Android bluetooth and was also compatible to the My phonak app. But that’s me and since my speech comprehension is so dismal suppressing background noise doesn’t really help me when it comes to better understanding what someone is saying. But I’ve said it a thousand times that only the wearer can truly say which aid works best for them. I also tried the oticon exceed and the resound Enzo. Neither of which I liked. I wish you both the best in your search to find the right aid. I’m not a cochlear implant fan myself for numerous reasons but am very careful when I say that because some people get a little hostile when they read that. Who knows what the future may bring. Hopefully she finds something that helps her now.

I deeply appreciate your detailed comments. Maybe we should wait for the next Naida UP. One problem is her Naida Q has had intermittent problems starting up. Frequently the battery door has to be closed 10 times before it finally works! We never know if it’s going to fail permanently.

On Naida Q there is what is called sound block which is completely adjustable. Not sure if this is what you mean by too much background suppression. In the Naida Q, my wife was initially given Sound Flow which automatically changes the programs. She hated that. It was best to have every program individually chosen by herself, and then I went in and adjusted the features such as sound block, sound recover, whistle block, etc.,depending on what she needed.

So you think the Naida marvels are more natural than the Naida B? or could it be that the audiologist just programmed the background suppression differently? your loss is less than my wife’s, but your comprehension is worse, although I’m sure her comprehension is worse than the 48% it was tested at five years ago.

Do you not mean Noise Block?

EDIT - I find too much Noise Block also takes away clarity of speech.

Yes, you are right. There’s also sound relax that, I believe, compresses loud sounds (I have that turned on for all programs). Since you are here and I know you had a long ear mold with the tube very close to your eardrum, have you had REM done with a microphone placed between the tube and the eardrum? It seems to me would be hard to get the microphone in exactly the right spot.

Just checking my most recent target programming, I also have Noise Block completely turned off for the program she has is for speech understanding.

When I tried the naida b there was nothing wrong with it but I felt it was limited for what I needed or could possibly have available for my loss. By background suppression I have mean the main program will attempt to subdue some of the background noise hoping to make speech comprehension better. I don’t buy into it but maybe it helps others. The marvel software phonak currently uses has been available for other phonak aids for a couple of years now but only became in January for the naidas. So the b’s may be on their way out. Something to keep in mind. The marvel software got a lot of positive reviews which is what attracted me to it to start with. The naida marvels can also be paired to both I phone and android phones. They also can be paired to the My phonak app which allows you to make adjustments to quite a few different things. Unfortunately the app doesn’t show a lot of the adjustments available until you pair up the marvel naidas but you can do that during a trial period assuming your audi allows a trial period. Whether these aids will help I can’t say. Some people will say they’re not strong enough but that’s crap. Look at my audi gram. If my audi cranks them up and then I use the app to further adjust the volume I might be able to make my head explode. But they’re expensive. If you decide to go with the naida b I might check to make sure that there will be support available from phonak since they’re now pushing the marvel software. As far as natural sounding everything to me sounds like how they’re supposed to. I tried the oticon exceed and everything in the background sounded like a motorcycle. People have said their car sounded like it needed a new muffler. Maybe you can program that out. I don’t know.

my wife has 10 or 20 DB more loss than you. She’s at maximum volume for the Naida QUP so I just don’t believe the Naida marvel SP will be strong enough. Again this is what Phonak just told me a couple weeks ago:

“We are committed to launching a Naída UP with the latest connectivity benefits including RogerDirect, and can confirm it is in development; however this is going to require more time, and we do not anticipate having a UP device in the Marvel family.”

So I think Phonak is committed to ultra-power hearing aids and I doubt they’ll delete the Naida B until a new ultra power is available. The question is whether we should or can wait.

Yes you could be right. I wish you the best