Mine went bad and it uses batteries.
I wouldn’t hold my iPhone up to my ear during a panoramic dental x-ray, either, though…! If it’s in your pocket, it’s well out of the beam whereas HAs either in the ear canal or behind the ear are significantly more exposed.
That’s a very valid point about the decreasing semiconductor manufacturing process size. It is conceivable that the components in newer generations of HAs could be more sensitive.
If my HAs were out of warranty I wouldn’t be wearing them in a CAT scan, dental x-ray, etc.
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Thanks for the reply. I have worn my ReSounds during routine dental X-rays with no issue. Never thought it being a problem. With a panoramic or one that may not be so routine, probably a good idea to be safe rather than sorry. Actually thinking to remove them won’t be easy.
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I had a panoramic dental x-ray, they did not mention removing my hearing aids and I did not. After that the left hearing aid was just static like an old AM radio in a storm. The receiver had to be replaced.
On my return to the dentist they said I should’ve been told to remove them.
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@w0pjk1: Given that my new Oticon More3s use 28nm technology, I would be reluctant to risk them in a panoramic x-ray.
Neither my dentist nor my Oticon material makes any allusion to the risk of damage due to high-energy beams, so I find your posting your direct experience valuable.
Thank you.
Hi @w0pjk1. Thanks for your interesting post, sorry to hear about your los. May I ask which HA you got the problem with. I only know your post from nov 2020 and do not know how you decided after that " Can’t decide between Phonak Paradise P90-RT or P90-13T"
I am in contact with Phonak sorting out and discussing radiation issues. Do hope to post more about it after awaiting there expert opinions.
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September 2019 I had a 3D scan that was required for a root canal procedure the following week. (Prescott Arizona)
I was wearing a pair of Signia 7Nx. It was after that the left receiver in the hearing aids was just static like noise. They knew beforehand I was wearing hearing aids.
I never cared for the Signia 7Nx, using as a spare now. I currently have Phonak Marvel P90 provided by the VA, they would be perfect if it wasn’t for the flawed app that never lets you retain a setting and only defaults to Auto. Dr Cliff in a response to me stated this spring there would be an update to correct this. I’ll believe that when I see it!
Phonak states on page 81 in the Paradise manual to remove and store the aids outside the exam room before undergoing medical or dental examination with X-ray.
Sounds like an expert opinion to me.
Jim
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@w0pjk1 Thanks for your info. May I additionaly ask how old your Signia’s 7Nx where. They where brought to market in 2017 I know. I live in the Netherlands and you get 5 years guarantee at most Audiciens over here.
I spoke to two Siemens guys of the CT support department to ask about this matter by telephone. They could not find a reason why this should happen… They looked over the support instruction manuals for engineers also and were also surprised about this sentence. Could not find scientific evidence. I will write an official letter now to Siemens to find out more. Siemens is producing medical X-ray devices as well as Hearing Aids to great luck…
From Phonak I still have no hard evidence, only also the suggestion that X- rays could probably not hurt, but Magnetic fields as in MRI of course could damage.
In almost every HA manual, not only Phonak and Siemens, it says you have to take them out. But untill now the HA engineers and X- ray manufacturers could not tell me why and say to me this is a kind of security sentence in the manual.
X- ray’s are ionising and that’s why they can have an effect of aging on substances. But that can hardly explain why a HA would go bad if you do not expose them for ages. There would be no substantial Magnetic Field induction either, is what they tell me. Very strange to me so that’s why I will keep searching on this topic…
I hope someone with damage on HA from the Netherlands is responding as this would make the case more interesting for f.i. television reportage.
I already contacted the Dutch board of medical devices, who controls the national medical device system (kind of FDA), to ask for an explanation. They will make an official report to Phonak but cannot change the facturers manual, but they also cannot see any explanation. By the way the scientific explanation for the manufacturers is not part of their job.
The last message I received is from Phonak Netherlands, in response to questions to Phonak Switzerland, Phonak US and Phonak Netherlands (Translation from Dutch to English by Google): “In response to your submitted messages (English and German) I would like to inform you the following. As you have probably learned before, wearing hearing aids while taking an X-ray is not recommended. This is also something that is mentioned in our instructions for use. In the meantime, I have also submitted a question to our head office to find out why this is exactly and whether this can be explained in more detail. This is because X-ray is not an MRI and, to my knowledge, does not use magnetic fields. Unfortunately I have not had any feedback on this yet. As soon as this is the case, I will contact you again as soon as possible.”
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@zuikoholic Thanks Jim for reporting page 81. As you can read in this topic we discussed this sentence before. It is not only Phonak Paradise who states this in the manual. Most manufacturers do.
I am working out the scientific explanation for this. Manuals always state behaviours for the users as pull the plug of your television out of the socket , wear a grounded bracelet or danger X-rays, do not enter.
I was working full time in last mentioned spaces professionaly with my Resounds as was my biggest friend colleague with his Phonak’s untill some years ago and never experienced any problems. (Retired now) Nor have we ever been advised by our Siemens and Philips application support staff in academical hospitals to take them off because of X-ray. Also our medical radiology trade association I never heard talking about this issue! But I will contact them too and report over here in this topic.
Just got officialy informed by Phonak Sales Support. Head quarters America answered my question as follows in quotes and italics. But I will keep on searching for more information and publish in this forum topic!
"Dear Mr. XXXXXX,
I have now received an answer from the head office. It is also indicated here that X-rays should not be a problem. However, if there is even the slightest chance that it can go wrong, the manual will tell you not to. Better to be safe than sorry. This is also a bit of covering. My advice in this will be to see on a case-by-case basis whether it can be done without hearing aids or not. One person will be able to follow instructions better than the other. If it is really impossible to do without hearing aids, just have them worn.
In addition, the story of the named patient that his / her hearing aids should be hearing aids is remarkable. In my opinion, this will be due to a combination of circumstances and not the X-ray.
I hope to have informed you with this.
Sincerely,
XXXXXX
Sales support
Phonak"
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I received my Signia 7Nx RC April 2018. The left receiver was replaced under warranty.
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Thanks for your additional info.
FYI: Phonak (which was not your Siemens HA, I know) is now discussing with me that what is in the manual thrue or not is not to be taken out. As I cannot change this kind of behaviour I will see if more more powerful media, if any, can influence this. Because I feel insulted as an x-ray professional.
In my country, it is against the law to make claims with regard to medical equipment and treatment that are not legally and conclusively proven.
Could it be that it’s not the ionizing radiation itself causing the damage, but the high electromagnetic flux generated by the x-ray apparatus as a whole?
There must be capacitors with high voltages, coils to drive the x-ray emitter (CRT?), etc that could - in close proximity - generate a magnetic flux strong enough to damage hearing aids.
But , Jim, I’m an old codger, not an electrical engineer!
Thanks for your suggestion. You sureley have a point over there. It is indeed what I also thought about. Only thing is that most of these technical parts are not in the same room as the patiënt is.
That’s why I asked my questions not only to HA and x- ray device sellers but also to x- ray departments in hospitals. And now I am in contact with the Dutch medical physics association to find out more about it.
We’ll see…
@emile.heilbron:
Merci de votre curiosité à l’égard de ce sujet-ci, docteur! Les réponses à venir nous aideront tous et chacun.
[Translation of French (which I miss having the occasion to speak!): Thanks for your curiosity about this subject matter, Doctor. The forthcoming answers will help all of us (lit.: each and every one)]
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@emile.heilbron: Have you learned anything more about our questions regarding x-rays and our hearing devices?
Thank you for your interest SpudGunner.
The answer is no. I am working on this since 7th of January when mazda4me started this for me interesting topic.
It’s like politics, lots of fake news and hidden information. But I still have questions pending to see if there is any clarity as to why it is in instructions for use if the scientists cannot provide scientific evidence why it should be harmful.
Untill now even the hearing aid manufacturers tell me x-rays should not be harmfull for their Hearing Aids. But if you aks them why it is in their usersmanual they get lost in diffuse talk and cannot give any scientific information.
What comes nearest in my thoughts also is the suggestion you stated about magnetic field induction in the neighbourhoud although this seems rather unlikely too. Approved medical equipment should be shielded and protected if there could be any chance of harmfull effects.
Radiology departments cannot take the risk of any situation in where people with cardiac devices, ventilated patients and monitoring equipment and explosive gasses are used etc. are exposed to unknown effects of the x-ray emitting equipment. These rooms should be as save as possibel to everything.
But that’s why I, after asking HA factories and x-ray equipment factories also asked in academical radiology departmentes now asked the National Dutch Medical Physics group to inform me. But they did not answer yet.
Untill now I did not find any specialist who told me x- rays could be harmfull for Haering Aids
apart from two wearers at this forum who have experienced their devices stopping / malfunctioning after X-ray examination, whereby even the manufacturers indicate that this must be a coincidence.
Zo lets wait a bit on the reaction of the medical physics group. Then I am done with it. Fake news will always be in our world and I can live with that as it is as it is. If one is afraid of anything, do your best to avoid it or go to the doctor or someone els who can help you.
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Thanks for your efforts to find the answer. I suspect that the actuaries and lawyers have gotten together and decided to include a warning because:
-
X-rays are becoming more ubiquitous for security reasons, and
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Chip foundries are using smaller and smaller architecture (Oticon’s new Polaris chip is 28nm - small for HAs, I’ve read).
Still, I am convinced that accidental leakage of strong EM flux fields is a real threat to some electronic devices - hearing aids among them.
I may be frightened of this Phantom EM/RF Monster for no good reason, but every time I cook something in my microwave oven, I wonder.
À bientôt
Spud
I asked this question to the Dutch Institute of Clinical Physics, here is their answer:
Dear Mr. XXXXX
I submitted your question to our Radiation Hygiene Committee and received the following answer:
From a physical point of view we cannot imagine that a hearing aid can break, but we cannot give individual advice and the patient should consult his / her audiologist / hearing care professional for this. We can say that with regard to the image quality a hearing aid may affect when an image is taken in this region. We recommend that you discuss this with the appropriate physician or employee in the imaging department conducting the examination.