Phonak users who DON'T use autosense

Hearing Aids
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Your audiologist can make adjustments to the Automatic program to help with clarity in a very noisy situation (the StereoZoom program). Curious what kind of domes you are wearing. My audiologist pushed me into a much more closed fitting (heavy double domes) and despite the additional occlusion, my speech understanding is significantly better. My gut tells me that many audiologist go too open for many patients and it negatively affects speech comprehension in certain noisy scenarios. Maybe one of the pro’s on this forum can comment.

Jordan

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Got molds which is the way to go me think. Everyone should get molds as standard.

Edit: I will discuss with my audiologist on what to do with the autoprograms. Thanks.

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This would have nothing to do with Autosense? Its cool you like it, but whats good for one doesn’t mean good for all unfortunately.

Of course there’s a difference between 90’s and say 30’s but one would think that having “less” in the 30 or 50’s would mean that you wouldn’t notice Autosense as much,because there’s only a few different programs they would change between, so no, its extremely noticeable in the higher models 70 and 90, nothing strange about one not liking Autosense.

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Here’s a link to a video which explains Autosense

Autosense

It explains that the four basic programs, Calm, Speech in Noise, Speech in Echo and Comfort in Noise are being constantly dynamically blended to give best results in changing situations. Then there are three additional programs which are used exclusively in situations which need them. These are Speech in Loud Noise, Speech in Car and Music.
If you have a Phonak basic model which does not have all of the seven programs then I guess Autosense just uses what you have got,

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I cannot even imagine how anyone doesn’t like autosense.
I wonder if it’s really something to do with less than ideal programming.
or maybe it’s only an issue for folks with a very different audiogram profile than what I have

the absolute only time I ever touch my aids is to turn on telecoil mode when I go to church. Otherwise I absolutely NEVER change the program, NEVER have to reset the volume…wake to bedtime, 7 days a week.

and mine are older so it wouldn’t be the latest and greatest version…

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This is very likely.
If the fitter sets up programs with big differences between the operating programs it will be very noticeable using AutoSense. The self programmers and fitters need to understand this to make AutoSense function as designed. AutoSense should be bumpless.

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67

Actually id say most unlikely, I’ve programmed quite a few over the years and i notice it, unfortunately some things just don’t work for some how the manufacturers intended, it quite noticeable to some of us.

Oh we fully understand this, but of course its not just DIY projects that the limitations of autosense show up, pro fits as well, the problem is not just how slow or fast it changes but it offen get the environmental input wrong.

Cheers

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68

This is exactly what I see as the problem. Fitters don’t understand, how the programming is designed to function. Pros or self fitters try to push the programs beyond design and end up with unhappy AutoSense clients.

We may need to agree on disagreeing on this.

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69

All good, no problem, i no longer use phonak any more anyway, I’m looking forward to their next-gen of HAs as i believe there will be a substantial improvement coming.

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I really appreciate this comment. It seems there is a subtle balance between taking advantage of the different programs yet ensuring that the switching between programs is not noticeable. I suppose trial and error will tell the fitter how much difference there can be in a particular control between programs. . .
Big John

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71

I’ve toyed with the idea of setting myself up for self programming many times
and I’ve often wondered if the configuration the audi has me set up with is really anywhere close to as good as it could be…
and I am pretty firm in the assumption that it is not…but only in some ways.

I’m a gadget guy, always have been and in many ways would love to try all the different features myself but as it is I really don’t know what I don’t know, when it comes to features and settings in the aids

So many variables… I only I can really perceive what I’m hearing. She really has no idea. The best she can do it ask questions and apply her paradigm of experience form many other patients to my answers.

But, my gut tells me there is wisdom in her set-up. That would clearly depend greatly on the audiologist and the user’s answers… but after an adaptation period I really can’t find anything to complain about. Could it be better? Maybe… but making that one thing better might have cascading negative affects on other things. Sometimes it’s wise to leave well enough alone.

and my intuition is telling me that this is might be what is happening here, in at least some cases.

As far as I know, the audi has turned off some of the program options based on my use case…really just an assumption. If that’s the case, maybe that’s based on some experience knowing that the less often autosense has to figure out and switch programs the better the experience will be for the wearer.

Once in a rare while I’ll notice when it switches. Maybe 90%-100% of the time I want to say it’s having to do with streaming (such as when the phone connects to my car’s bluetooth and the streaming setting change). It’s very short and really not a big deal. I just accept it. Mostly the things are just switching and I never know it.

I remember back to my trial in the Oticons. I was new to hearing aids and was exploring much more than normal, but with those aids you had to either use the volume buttons to select sequentially through the programs…which required remember which program number 5 was, and which was number 3… OR you could use the phone app. It was a really great phone app and made it easy, but still every time I went into a new environment I had to play with it…is #2 better in this situation or is number 5? No wait, let me try #2 again… nope #5 is better…but oh wait, #4 is good too… ugh

The phonak app even today is lightyears worse than the Oticon’s app was… but the thing is, I NEVER have to use it…thanks to autosense

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I wear naida paradise p30 ups. The aids only have two programs in the autosense. One is calm and the other speech in noise. So I don’t hear any strange combinations.

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@Raudrive So THIS is what I see as the problem… when people post on forums without knowing details of others posts. Not trying to be argumentative here but you do not seem to comprehend the actual issue that has been explained here several times in detail. Just making comments like this about self programmers thinking we are all ignorant and unlearned is really unnecessary, especially here where folks are trying to give others information. So take this how you will but if you don’t really have something positive to add to the conversation, I would suggest keeping your opinions to yourself.

Now for the record… I self program my aids using the many audio playback features in the target software playing in a soundproofing enhanced room. I start by opening the calm situation setting and make all my adjustments there. Once I have that set to what I think is the best, I then change ALL the other settings by using the “use settings from calm situation” so that all the others will closely match that. I do this EVERY time I make an adjustment. This way I avoid the jarring changes in settings from one program to the next.

Now once again I will try and communicate the ACTUAL problem. Changing settings is NOT the problem. And the different settings ALL do what they do extremely well in my estimation based upon the listening situation that they are attempting to “fix”. The PROBLEM is that Autosense does not always change programs correctly to a specific listening situation. In other words, around 30% of the time, it changes to a program setting that it THINKS is the correct one, when it is actually NOT the correct listening situation. This can be particularly annoying when it induces Ultrazoom. Now AGAIN, Ultrazoom works extremely well…in CERTAIN situations. BUT by nature of what Ultrazoom does, it can be a huge detriment to certain listening situations.

Look we can debate this all day but in the end using aids like this only serves to make one appreciate how incredible the human brain is at picking and choosing hearing of sounds. And one last thing for the record. I dont self program because I think I am a know it all. I have learned a TON over the years doing this for sure but for the first few years I went back to my Audi all the time and honestly it is frustrating trying to communicate with someone what changes you are looking for, and then having to go back over and over. Now I have a great Audi company. But my belief is the best way to get aids to function well for me is to make small changes, and dont make too many adjustments all at once. So on both my sets of aids, I have made probably 10 or so changes a month for several months. That way I can try something out, and continue tweaking as I go. Make a small change… wait a couple days to see how it works… and then do it again. So my Audi would absolutely want to kill me if I asked for 10 appointments in a month, to say nothing of the fact that no one can hear what I am hearing. Now I retired after 45 years in the technology business, so I understand that self programming is not for everyone, but there are some folks out there who are actually pretty experienced at all this and we are all not a bunch of blind armatures groping int he dark here. Stepping off my soap box now…

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I hadn’t noticed this option. Just tried it and had expected the sliders in the individual programs to move to match Calm Situation but they didn’t move. Can you confirm that the sliders don’t move when you “use settings from calm situation?”
Big John

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I hate the lumity… I am a musician so I went with Widex after months of no luck and the Widex is amazing, im just waiting for my new molds to be made

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They are aggressive sometimes and would sometimes go on the wrong setting at the wrong time

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I’m just starting a 45 day trial of Lumity 90’s and they are a big improvement over my previous Audeo Marvel 5.0 but I have much to learn and this discussion is no doubt a good place to start. So I plan to return in a day or two once I get a few fires put out at my current residence. So much to do and so little time but hearing as well as possible is high on my priority list so I shall return because already I’m finding instances where I cannot hear properly and hopefully I can find a way to continue to improve my hearing with these aids. Thanks for posting this helpful thread.

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I have had the lumity. They suck… I have Widex because I am a musician… Widex is the best!!!

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you can have it as a selectable programme, rather than default

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Two things in mind, one is poorly programmed aids as only 30 % of audiologists and HIS use REM and second, most audiologists and HISs do not check to see if the hearing aid meets the manufacturer spec’s. Too many hearing aids do not meet the manufacturer spec’s even the ones returned from the manufacturer for repairs.