I just played around in the Philips fitting software, HearSuite. I had a dummy user set up in the system, using 100 receivers with Microshell Detect, with three programs set. I changed the user setup to have open domes. It asked me if I wanted to re-write the existing programs with the new “instrument acoustics”. I told it no. I then created a new program based on the default general program. When I compared the fitting curves between the old general program and the new one, they were different. However, the differences were very small, about 2 or 3 db of gain in the range 250-750Hz. So it looks like you can have different programs for different domes, but it may not be worth the trouble.
Please note that I am a self-trained rookie at running this software, so don’t trust what I am saying.
I wonder which fitting formula would be ideal for my HA when I achieve target loudness on my CI side. Currently, I have non-REM, but quite good NAL-NL2.
I’m considering whether DSL (as it is reportedly louder) could be a better option to equalize loudness balance between the CI and HA sides.
Aaaaand, there are rumors that NAL-NL3 will come out soon…
Cool experiment! I see what you did, and at some point I’ll have to give it a go in Genie2.
It should work the same. @Volusiano what’s your take on @stevepriceloco 's post?
I gave it a go with Genie 2 and @stevepriceloco trick does work on Genie 2 as well. Basically you change the fitting in the Selection page > Acoustics menu, but pick No for the Recalculate option to leave the previous programs alone. But now with a different fitting selected, you can add a new program that’s a copy of the other program, and it’ll prescribe only the newly added program to the new fitting choice. You can verify in Fine Tuning that the gain curves between the 2 programs look different.
I had 9040’s and returned and got the 9050’s. The 9040’s seemed better all around. My question is about open domes size and if the size affects hearing improvement. I have 6, 8, and 10 mm. Was using the 8mm and am trying the 10mm today.
Probably should make another appointment at Costco to see if they can improve my hearing especially in noise. I should tell them to put the settings they had for the 9040’s into the 9050’s with no changes. I have such a hard time determining if they sound better in that little sound proof room. Always sound different when I get home.
Thanks for doing it 1st so i don’t have to
Actually I personally don’t have a use case for seperate program slots taken up for different fittings.
I do appreciate different fitting rationales, though!
As Mr. V mentioned, Thanks @stevepriceloco for uncovering another hidden feature in the Oticon/Philips treasure chest. @tenkan can you test @Volusiano 's and @stevepriceloco 's findings in Target?
Maybe it can be done?
Yeah I most certainly would like to check this,same with Connexx and SmartFit, would be good to know that it’s possible with other manufacturers software.
Just to circle back to the original topic . . . the 9050 & noise . . .
To celebrate a couple of birthdays we escaped from our cave and went to racetrack yesterday for the last weekend of thoroughbreds here in the north country. We had an extended lunch in one of their restaurants, so I didn’t have to contend with race announcements etc – just restaurant hubbub - and of course, the excitement of the winners. The restaurant is tiered tables and we were on the lowest level right next to the monster glass window. I had my – self-programmed - 9050s (double vented bass domes w/100 receivers) ready with the Phillip’s suggested Speech in Noise program and another one which was a duplicate of that but with the focus switched to fixed versus the adaptive directionality, as well as a bog standard general every day and my stripped music listening programs. I toggled through all four of these as well as trying the environment without HAs. I came away quite impressed with what the adaptive directionality brought to the party. I could certainly hear the conversations at the adjacent tables – behind more than in front btw – but this never really impaired my ability to hear my tablemates. It dampened the noise level sufficiently isolating the conversations just as it should. As I moved around the room – going up to the betting wicket etc – I could still hear well without strain and without needing any repetition! Our waiter had a thick Eastern European accent, my step-son is a bit of a loud talker and my d-i-l is Asian with a somewhat higher pitched accented voice and while the sound of all of them was pushed mid-high forward somewhat – her voice in particular – it was never problematic.
These are my first HAs so I don’t have anything to compare them to other than a week with Phonak Spheres some months back on test. I can’t really say if they were better or worse at this point but . . . imho . . . the Phillips 9050 is good . . . and certainly good enough for me.
Thanks for sharing this. My brother also recently got the 9050 (from his older KS10) and he likes it a lot, too. My ears perked up when I read that you did trial the Phonak Sphere (I90 I presume?) some month back. Their AI for speech in noise has been said (and even technically measured) to be the best in class amongst all the latest model hearing aids. I’m surprised to hear that it didn’t leave you with quite a long lasting enough impression, since it seems to blow many people away with its speech in noise capability. Can you share your impression of it with more details, if you remember much of anything about it? Thanks.
I was referred to a local shop (a Connect Hearing (Sonova) franchisee) by a neighbour and the audi handed the I90s to me, did a quick 3 minute fitting and turned me loose. She told me nothing about them – not even the model # or price – assuming I was a sure sale. I only wore them in one noisy environment that week – a busy restaurant on the night of the Moon festival in September. They did a great job with noise because I could hear my tablemates very well although I thought everything sounded exceedingly artificial – as if I was listening to conversation bubbles – if that makes sense. For music listening – not BT but direct – I found them harsh and spitty - but I assume that I could have tuned that in the software. When I returned them, her assistant quoted me $8190 - which I thought was an insane price. After that experience, I started researching things and found this site etc etc.
Thanks for sharing. The “listening to conversation bubbles” makes sense. It’s really the only way to encapsulate the speech that you want to hear near you. I wonder while they create these bubbles for you to hear the people in front or nearby to you, how will you hear people who call out to you from further away, or perhaps if you want to eavesdrop on somebody at the next table? Or perhaps to focus on a piano playing on the side, etc. It’s hard to say I guess, because sometimes you want this, other times you want that, and you can’t have everything. The trick is either to know what the wearer wants to hear and focus on that, but hearing aids can’t be mind readers yet. Or the trick is to try and find and create a balance of sounds so that you can hear everything, not as well as in a bubble to some degree, but well enough that with focus, you can have your brain zoom in on the stuff that you want to hear.
I think that it is feasible - with experimentation - to come up with a program to help. While I didn’t find the fixed directionality useful yesterday, shifting to full pinna might help a user to focus on a more distant sound source as long as a closer source didn’t overpower it or the room acoustics didn’t stymie it.
Not wishing to hijack this thread, but the “More” I read about the effect of Spheric Mode, the"More" I’m reminded of Oticon MSI and the NNS Difficult setting set to Max efffect.
Sure, amplify the sound in the “bubble”, but distort the sound outside it.
Same as the “More”, but with even a higher dB value!
Yes! I had the exact same thought when I heard the word “bubble”, but I didn’t want to mention the Oticon thing here because it’s a Philips thread. But for sure it seems like there’s a price to pay when you artificially (thus appropriately called AI) isolate the speech sound way too much from the surrounding noise. For sure that’s “wonderful” when you engage in a conversation with somebody to have the machine filter out everything else and focus on their voice. But what if you don’t? How would the machine know when you want to hear more, and when you want to hear less, within the time span of a couple of minutes?
I was just at a Xmas party last Saturday, and there were around 40 people in the house in the great room (where the kitchen and dining table and living room is all in one wide open space). Of course it was utter total chaos sound wise with many people speaking. I wear the Real 1, and it’s been quite a while now since I’ve been to a big noisy party like this, and if I had my OPN 1 on like before, it would have been quite overwhelming for me. But the Real 1 helped keep things in check, I could hear everything, but it was very “manageable” and not overwhelming. I can tell that if I want to focus on the person in front of me speaking for a little while, but then start to eavesdrop (well, not intentionally) on somebody else talking 5 to 10 feet away, I can switch focus on that conversation as well, although probably not sounding as crystal clear compared to someone near me.
Then it makes me wonder if I’m in a “bubble” to hear the voice of the person near me only, but if I no longer talk to them, but start to have a wandering eye around the room and see what I could hear from elsewhere, it’s probably would be very disconcerting to be “stuck” in that bubble. Of course I can always get out of the Spheric mode (talking about the Phonak Sphere now) to pick up other voices in the room as well, but then what if the person in front of me resumes the conversation with me? Do I have to quickly get in and out of the “bubble” to engage and disengage back and forth all night long? There’s something to be said about having a “balanced” soundscape and not be in a bubble, as wonderful as it might be at times. I guess it boils down to whether you want the hearing aids to “manage” what you hear, or you want to have a balanced soundscape so that you yourself can 'manage" what you want to hear.
By the way, I didn’t have the max of 10 dB NNS in my default program, it was only 8. But I didn’t feel the need to switch to the Speech in Noise program I had, which was 10 dB.
I’ll blame it on you, @flashb1024 , if anybody accuses me of hijacking the thread here any further than what you’ve already started, LOL!
I have the 9050s w Galaxy A53 5g and don;t know why but I’m getting calls in my HAs. I have to answer the phone “normally” no tapping .Going for my second visit and will ask if they can figure it out.
Nancy
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