Thanks for your post.
It’s a miracle I got Phonak Audeo Paradise P90R’s.
My audi told me he was 59 when we parted. He tried to set them up for 2 years. I had ear plugs. Not hearing aids.
Your description describes my experience in Mississauga Ontario.
I thought that it was stressful getting hearing aids 20+years ago. Finding someone to help me by doing a good setup was darn near impossible.
There are good audiologists that post here… A shout out and great respect for Neville.
DaveL
Toronto
As a younger wearer and a female I have noticed a lot of information (and responses on this forum) assume that I am neither of those things.
My biggest advance occurred when someone reviewed a book positively. the book has changed my life.
HEAR & BEYOND
Live skillfully with hearing loss
Shari Eberts
Gael Hannan
I learned a lot. It’s help me get past being a victim of hearing loss, to focusing on communicating better.
Welcome to the forum.
My best experiencw with an audi was actually in Canada in Owen Sound. The hook on my hearing aid broke while in town on a trip. My friend gave me the business number of and acquaintance that happened to be an audi. Well his business number was a cellular line, he answered. Here in the US you talk to automated messages in circles. But anyway he told me to come to his office, he dehumidified the aids, cleaned them up, replaced both hooks, replaced the tubes. Then he asked me if i was happy with them generally and i said no, told him the situation and he suggested we try audiogramdirect on phonak, so we did and thats when my old hearing aids became somewhat useful. He let me perform the test myself on his computer. I was amazed. He educated me a bit, made suggestions, and together we were able make the hearing aids useful. If i was able to continue seeing him i am sure we woulda come up with something better. But i live in ohio. So after i saw him was when i startee investingating self-tuning.
Oh it’s the same story in central Europe, they’ll give you €5k estimate for premium HAs, then inform you that they have an ongoing sale currently (which lasts forever apparently) and will lower the price by 1k.
I was able to buy the same HAs without the “clinician/audi” tax for 1,8k, pretty much straight from the manufacturer (I found a clinician which forwarded them to me, and did the initial setup).
Then DIYed them.
My first pair of HAs provided by the VA via a contractor were Oticon ONs. She fitted the HA and spent such time as necessary to make sure I could hear better. I did not understand then that I had options to try different brands nor that I could return for additional fittings to improve my experience. At that point I felt like “Ah, I have hearing aids, I can hear better.” I had no idea that “better” comes in 256 colors. She did follow up after 30 days to basically check that they still worked.
Round Two, four years later were Phonak Audeo M90s which I chose because I could use them with my Android phone. I was in heaven with “voices in my head” making phone calls. The quality of my hearing experience though acceptable, was not taking advantage of all that was available with proper fittings.
Finally, after another four years, I bit the bullet and bought an IPhone and came back to Oticon Reals. And I took up DIY fitting. No matter how many times I went in for fittings with the Reals, the Audi seemed to be pressed for time and unwilling to volunteer information about the different features and how they are used. His fitting procedure was pretty much to use the default prescription settings and fool around with the upper frequency range settings. I never once experienced him turning a feature on or off and I felt his time pressure such that I didn’t insist that he explain the features to me.
It turns out I prefer manual camera settings to the automatic settings and I like my hearing aids the same way. I want to control them and not have an algorithm assume I have changed environments and automatically tweak my settings. I realize I am wasting the power of my Reals, but I can switch between my default, music and speech settings and be pleased with that. Okay, I’m a control freak.
Big John
What I found most difficult about “shopping” for hearing devices?
Looking back I had no idea how individualized our hearing is. Reading and researching on this forum and other was sometimes confusing, sometimes I would ask a question that I found important, but others didn’t find the question to be worthwhile. I didn’t ge it. . I couldn’t - you don’t know what you don’t know. Learning or re-learning for me is to remember that all questions are of value. This was the hardest part - figuring it all out.
I bought into the idea that the audiologist was very important. And, they are! However I probably could have stayed with the less expensive Costco KS 10 hearing wise. However, after trying the rechargeables, I really wanted HDs that ran on batteries and I have been delighted with them - they fit in better with my lifestyle. Also as much as I researched my audiologist - they left that practice shortly thereafter and I ended up with a new audiologist. So things change.
I just went back in for a yearly hearing test and a check of my HDs. This is where I realized I learned a bit more. I could tell the audiologist what was amiss whereas I am not quite sure I would have been able to be as clear when I first got my HDs.
Overall my biggest pain point was in figuring this all out (research, knowledge of my personal issue, etc. ) and in finding an audiologist to work with, and I found it time-consuming. Overall, I am pleased with the experience, feel I have learned a lot and I am delighted with my hearing and HDs I have. I also appreciate this forum and the Staff that participate - a big thank you!
I’ve had lots ofhelp here on the forum. But it was a slow start. Way back the forum had a different name. When I found it again the intro was painful and I almost left. Some individuals have gone, and things are better for me now.
I’ve watched countless videos. Dr what’s his name who seems to me have burnt out and left From Arizona.
I’ve read some books.
One was recommended here.
HEAR & BEYOND
Live Skillfully with Hearing Loss
Shari Eberts
Gael Hannan
it’s amazing. They are amazing.
and,
VOLUME CONTROL
HEARING IN A DIFFERENT WORLD
BY DAVID OWEN.
He touches on the hardware side. It was a slow start but got better. He has strong opinions about some of the things that bother us a lot. Cost is one.
I went through a stage where I didn’t consider COSTCO. When I realized that the names were code for prime product disguised by name I wished to know more. When COSTCO walked away from Phonak I was glad I didn’t have their product.
I’ve learned that people on the forum come from all over the world, and everyone’s circumstances are different.
Finally, My first Phonaks were provided by the most wonderful and most skilled audiologist I’ve ever had. In 20 years of use buying replacement hearing aids has truly been stressful.
And being hard of hearing has affected me and my wife. It’s been most stressful for her.
And she hears well.
DaveL
Toronto
For me, my potential pain was greatly reduced by buying at Costco, where I had years of excellent buying experience, after seeing a private practice Audi I could not trust after considering what he would have charged me. Costco has brands that cost about $1500 that are essentially the same as those sold at private audis for 3 to 4 times more. Their HAs are made by the same companies as those sold for more, using the same technology. Costco has superior warranty and return policies that a private practice audi could not afford to offer. Costco offers in person service. Some Costco fitter technicians are more skilled than others, but you can always request to see another one at the same store, or go to a different store. For me, Costco is much more convenient than going to a private practice audiologist. Unless there is no nearby Costco for you, this should be an easy choice. If there is no nearby Costco, Costco sells OTC HAs online at Costco.com. This purchase alone will pay for membership and you can continue to save by buying what Costco sells online. They may not always sell the most premium products, but they always sell good stuff at a significant discount with incomparable return policies. They are a very low margin, limited product offering, high volume seller. If I must buy online, I much prefer Costco over Amazon.
Im really glad you had this experience.
It’s a reminder that we have good audis here. And a reminder that good results come from referrals.
A class like yours, plus a nearby Costco, would serve those who need hearing-help very well. I was lucky to discover a similar class at my college-for-seniors many years ago when my growing deafness first appeared. A group of needful users grew from that association and became a force for good in the community. We formed a chapter of HLAA, which is still operating, with varying strengths.
What a great story to hear! I’d love for that to happen here in Jacksonville.
It seems there WAS/is? a chapter of HLAA, the national organization for hearing loss, in Jacksonville. This is what we grew into in Asheville, an HLAA chapter. These chapters can be go-and-stop depending on the energy of volunteers, but a few willing people can bring them back into action. http://hla-jax.org/
Thank you for your post
Spot on.
Adding some…changing hearing aidsshoild be easy.
Peripheral devices shouldn’t be needed
If they are adding them should be easy with no licensing fees
Hearing aid companies take note
This tech guru would be nice, but if you think HAs are, with bundled pricing, too expensive now …. The tech guru up you describe is not a low wage position. Somebody has to pay for it. Were that service free, I would like it, but I would not want to have to pay for it. Who has a landline anymore anyway?
That’s exactly what your Audiologist ‘should be’. The tech Kahuna for your ears and technology. I’m 100% confident that if any one of my clients physically calls in, or rings in I can give them the benefit of over a quarter of a century of industry experience and knowledge.
That said, I don’t deal in ALL brands and I can’t tell you whether the new ‘Intent’ is better than the Starkey Genesis as I’m not prescient (yet 
). Also, you have to try and fail in a few situations to get a feel for how everything works on an aid. A few years ago I was talking at a conference with a lady who wrote one of the best texts on hearing and fitting aids, so - an Uber-Guru. She was doing a presentation at the conference, but further to the chat I found out she’d only fitted one pair of aids ‘to a friend’ in the last year. Which sort of highlights the issue. In becoming the ‘authority’ on fitting aids, or running a social media profile/website, getting manufacturers onside to trial ALL of their products with a wide enough group of people is not just unlikely, but economically impossible.
So, you’re stuck with an imperfect situation, plus Manufacturers/suppliers who have spare dollars who can throw money at the AI search engines to further muddy the water.
IMHO, understanding the pricing model at various clinics and what is included in the bundle takes time. I have used 3 clinics so far. Below are my thoughts on each:
I went to the clinic my insurance referred me to and for which it would pay its part. The AuD was fine, but each checkup was an extra fee and the initial cost was about $5k in 2014. I liked the Starkey Halos that I bought there.
First clinic sold out to Audibel. So, I went there because they would work with my insurance. Every visit was a sales call for them and I saw little benefit from their service. I did replace my Halos with an updated Audibel version. The Audibel units never worked as well as my Halos. One day, the RIC on one of my HAs broke. I called to get a new one and was told it would take a few weeks to get the replacement. I called a private clinic a mile from my house and they replaced the RIC that day. As I was bit their client, I had to buy the part, but that seemed fair.
The clinic near my home from which I got the replacement RIC not only replaced the RIC, but did an audiogram and ensured the HAs were performing as they should using REM. As the aids were locked, they could not tweak the settings, but did confirm that they were in the ballpark. Part & service was all for under $100.
When I finally tired of the sales pressure from clinic #2, I went back to the local clinic #3. We did the whole process. Based on my prior experience, I knew that I would need to get new HAs. Not a big deal as I was not all that happy with the Audibel units anyway. It was probably more the fitter than the aids, but I was done with them.
After we do the audiogram, we have the pricing talk. This clinic uses the bundled pricing model. They would not itemize what each item cost, but they did have a list of what was included in the price. There was no a la carte option, but for 3 years there would be no additional cost and the price included custom molds. Inflation adjusted, the pricing was similar to what I had been paying for just HAs. I also asked if the price he quoted could be paid on a credit card. When affirmed it could, we negotiated the cash (check) price for 2 sets of HAs (my wife & me).
I am 2 years in with this clinic and they have provided everything they promised. Currently my HAs are at Starkey as the 24 hour battery life that was spec’ed was down to under 16 hours and was beginning to die before my day was done. I currently have loaners of the same model that work as they should. Given that I got 2 years out of the batteries, I asked the AuD to ask Starkey to (if they are simply replacing the units) replace them with disposable units of the same model. He said he would ask, but he doubted they would make that switch. Frankly, if they don’t make the switch and what comes back works as well as the loaners, that would be fine as well. We shall see on Tuesday.
Biggest pain point is writing the check for 2 pairs of HAs. Next is finding the right AuD. Third is figuring out the value provided by completing clinics with bundled pricing.
We have 2 professional jobs, so affording the HAs has not been an issue. We have been getting new HAs when the insurance benefit was available, every 4 years. As we move to retirement, we will be moving around a lot - full timing in a motorhome. Given that there are Costco stores in most cities in the US and their pricing/value model seems to be pretty good, we will probably switch to Costco. Even if they don’t take our insurance, our out-of-pocket will be a bit lower.
ETA - Starkey replaced my HAs with rechargeable units. They refused to sub out for disposable units.
Truly appreciate your post. Thank you.
You provide real value
DaveL
Yes, I’m involved with the local chapter, but my OLLI classes on 10 Smart Ways to Hear Better, has not resulted in an influx of new, interested members. As you say, getting volunteers for chapters, waxes and wanes.
Sounds like a good idea for an OLLI class! Good luck at building momentum in Jacksonville 
!