Warning Regarding Hearing Aid Purchases

Hearing Aids
#1

I’d love to give out the name of a very large HA dealer on East coast who has several offices. Like 12 to 15 spread out in a few states. But I won’t since we’re probably not allowed to identify individual business on HT.

I’ve been around the block wearing HA’s for over 40 years and thought I knew the ins and outs when trialing and purchasing. But about fifteen years ago I didn’t read the fine print on HA purchase contract close enough to realize I’d been taken.

Mr. HA dealer offered a slightly below price quote for the HA’s I wanted which ran around $6,700 for half shell power hearing aids. The aids were a well known brand but for what ever reason HA dealer ordered half shell - when he should of ordered full shell. Well as soon as I got home wearing new aids my wife said “what’s that awful squealing sound” knowing full well it was coming from my new aids. Unfortunately high frequency squeal was at a level I couldn’t hear. Feedback or general squeal continued for three, four days when wife and I realized it was time to return aids. ASAP

Reason for aid squeal was probably two fold in that volume set level was too high for aids to control plus there might of been a fit issue. In any case I realized during the course of three, four days (during trial period) these new aids were not what I wanted due to constant feedback/squealing. In very rare occasions in the past when I returned HA’s that did not work out, there was just a charge for general hearing test which my insurance covered and then out of pocket expense for molds to be made. So worst case scenario $150 loss and back to square one.

At the time I returned the two half shell aids I was intent to hold off buying anything else (replacements) until I had done more research and waited a few months to see what new came on the market. But when I returned new aids I was informed that I had two options by my “low class” aid supplier. Either try a different HA - per agreement I signed and then purchase or (here’s the kicker) don’t buy either first HA or second and then pay 7% of cost of hearing aid. Or roughly $469 for nothing - if two types of HA don’t work out.

Now I’m a big boy and I did sign purchase agreement before testing first set of aids and unfortunately I didn’t notice the 7% payment if I rejected two different types of hearing aids. To make a long story short two weeks later after leaving first HA dealer (Audi) I found a new Audi that offered full in the ear aids (two) $800 cheaper then my friendly 7% down rip-off dealer.

So bottom line - Please read every little detail you might have to sign at a Audi’s office, HA dealers office, Aid supplier office, health clinic etc., and make sure you don’t have to pay for anything if you reject a hearing aid within 30 to 45 days of testing. Sure the aid dealer needs to be reimbursed for a hearing test and also for ear molds to be made for one ear or two. But other then that don’t pay a dime more.

Unfortunately I think there are many, many others out there that either over pay for hearing aids or some how feel they need to pay through the nose if they take up someone’s time to test an aid they might not want (during trial period) yet get hit with some crazy bill for taking up Audi’s time.

I probably should of gone to small claims court to recoup the $469 I paid my friendly rip-off aid dealer way back when - but again I did sign an agreement I thoroughly didn’t read as closely as I thought.

Good luck future aid buyers

1 Like
#2

Small claims court probably not worth it - even if you get a judgment, that doesn’t mean the guy will pay you.

Sorry this happened to you.

1 Like
#3

What about the other services they provided you with?

1 Like
#4

Not sure what your are referring to regarding “other services”. This was not a doctor’s office but someone who strictly sells hearing aids - for a profit. You get your hearing level tested, you have molds taken/made and then order aids. A “legit” hearing aid dealer lets you test (wear) aid(s) for 30 to 45 day and then let’s you decide if you want them permanently. If you reject or return aids there should be “zero” out of pocket expenses other than cost for hearing test and molds made. Pretty straight forward eccept a lot of Aid Dealers try to take advantage of customers by adding extra costs or as I stated “require some bogus percentage cash payment” if there is no sale.

Regarding small claims court you never know if the defendant will show up and then if you do win judgement, you have to figure a way enforce the court ruling. My assumption is most HA dealers would rather reimburse customers for gross over charges than face negative publicity. But you never know.

Unfortunately in the land of HA’s there is very little regulation and guidance. Which is really sad since your dealing with thousands of dollars in cost with very little government oversite.

#5

So after they ordered hearing aids that you picked out yourself without any guidance, they just handed them to you in the box and let you walk out with no fitting, orientation, or follow-up. You’re right, that sounds like a really bad place.

#6

My provider charges me zero, nada, to trial new aids. don’t like the first brand after three weeks? Fine, try the next, also at no charge. And no commitment to buy. Of course, I’ve known this provider for two decades. I suppose that makes a difference.
But even with a brand new provider…who walks out the door with their new hearing aids still in box, unprogrammed, only to find they’re not what was ordered…and is then stiffed by the provider?

Sorry, there’s something too make believe, too trollish about this whole post. Yeah, geeze, take the damn hearing outs of box and have them fitted…duh!—in the office. it they aren’t the ones that you ordered, you or the provider should know straight off.

Sorry if this actually happened, but geeze…

#7

I think Neville’s comments were sarcasm.

2 Likes
#8

I don’t know about sarcasm. Maybe this guy really did receive the hearing aids with no or next to no professional services–I’ve heard of some pretty bad outfits. At the very least they appear to have failed to provide education about what might cause feedback and what the reasonable solutions were such that he thought the solution was to return them rather than simply resolve the feedback. It also sounds like they might not have clearly reviewed the purchase agreement, since he was so unpleasantly surprised later.

But I do often find it puzzling that people will pay “out the nose” for the services of chiropractors and naturopaths and don’t demand their money back when the treatment doesn’t actually resolve their issues, but there is a general feeling that hearing care professionals, who are actually doing something that has tangible benefits, should work for free. The weird thing is that it only appears to be the case if there is a hearing aid involved. In my experience, patients are happy to pay professional fees just to come chat about, say, tinnitus for a few hours. But as soon as a device is involved then it all boils down to that and everything else is devalued.

I think there’s an argument to be made that this particular return fee was steep, and certainly there do exist places where there wouldn’t have been a fee at all. But declaring that there should be no fee anywhere for the associated professional services is a bit wild to me.

I also didn’t think American doctors were not for-profit. :wink:

5 Likes
#9

Didn’t mean to put words in your mouth, but what you described seemed extremely unlikely and seemed intended to make the point that maybe OP had received some other services.
One could get the impression from reading the forum that one should expect to be able to trial as many hearing aids as one wants at no cost. Does make one wonder where the professional is supposed to make up for having given away their time. :>)
In a previous post (long ago) you asked about an hourly billing rate for physicians. I just got a bill and charge for a 20 minute appointment was $190 so I think $500-$600 an hour is likely pretty ballpark. Likely both higher and lower charges exist based on both location and specialty. I would think an audiologist would need to charge at least half that for billable hour ($250-$300 per hour) to make a go of it. The $476 as the cost for trialing 2 hearing aids doesn’t sound excessive in that perspective. I am not making excuses for poor service, but I think there’s a real connection between what people consider exorbitant hearing aid prices and people expecting many services to be free.

3 Likes
#10

I’ve bought pro photo equipment that cost as much as hearing aids. I did my research and selected my gear, buying into a system. Along the way I bought many lenses that were same brand.

Point is I was able to do my research. All the pro gear works. And I never considered getting anything for free.

When I realized I was hard of hearing I had been in denial for a long time. I said, “eh?” or excuse me, please repeat what you said. Or I bluffed and thought I knew what was going on. That likely went on for years.

Then I needed to pick a hearing aid supplier. How do you do that? Yellow pages!
If the supplier had different makes, then I asked “how did you pick that for me?” All I knew was that it was a hearing aid. Made by a company.

I tried to do research. That was long before this forum. That was an intensely difficult and stressful process.

Point I’m trying to make is that is that in the worst case there are many ways the purchase can go wrong.

Find a supplier? Good luck.
Hearing test? At first I had to have a lot of faith in the individual giving it to believe it had value.
Pick a make? Wow cost is so high
Pick a type? In the ear? behind the ear? receiver in the ear?
One hearing aid? I can’t afford two.

Then there are the people who do Quick Fit and send you out on a trial…is that enough?

I see your comments Neville. I respect you and learn a lot. But my own experience over 20 years of use has been terrible. I did have the perfect audiologist who provided my first set of Phonaks. 4 years of incredible service. Every time I left her business I heard better. She sold her business. Wish her good health and happiness!

Thank you to all the good people that participate here, and are providers. However, most of the 20 years I’ve had HA’s I’ve thought the system was broken.

DaveL
Toronto

#11

Ok, replace ‘Pro-Photo equipment’ with ‘Titanuim tooth inserts’

Can you see how the locus of argument moves towards a professional delivering the services?

Just because the manufacturers are currently hell bent on commoditising the product and removing the experience and fitting skills from the industry doesn’t mean that it’s the correct approach for the large majority of hearing aid users.

3 Likes
#12

I had three sets of HAs prior to my CI. None offered a free trial. None offered more than one brand at their office, but they did cover the choices within their brand well. The service was good and I had no complaints with four different offices in different states. Not til I read this forum and went to my current AuD was I aware that a trial was a thing. Some of use want the specifics and details and choices. Others might find that daunting and run from it. I will specify that all were audiology doctor offices. None were just hearing aid stores.

1 Like
#13

I understand

However, I would quickly volunteer for a focus group as a user; I think they could do a lot better.

My take…you and others that post here are decidedly in the "preferred’ and excellent category.

Yet on Youtube I see burnout–Dr Cliff as the most recent apparent burnout.

DaveL
Toronto

1 Like
#14

When you’ve been wearing HA’s as long as me - you don’t need an orientation. But reading the fine print is always important - even if you have to take paper work home and read it under no time limit. Not sure what. you mean by fitting after aid molds were made and aids were delivered. I put aids in and at the time (if they were squealing) I certainly couldn’t hear it. Maybe HA dealer knew aids had feedback but he sure didn’t tell me and then when I got home wife says - “What is that awful noise” I’m hearing.

Follow up was when I returned and HA dealer put some cotton in air release channel. As if that feeble attempt would work, like putting glue on a broken water pipe. I might of tried another HA brand with Audi, but like I said I found another that offered an aid I eventually bought (two) for $800 cheaper then first Audi offered.

Win some - lose some but no one should have to pay close to $500 for rejecting aids that squeal like a pig.

#15

Makes me sad to hear that the situation is so bad just down the road in T.O. Sometimes when I see stories about bad service on the boards I like to imagine it’s largely an American problem.

2 Likes
#16

Sorry MDB if you don’t like “reality” stories. One has to wonder if you think Used Car Salesmen are looking out for your best interests when you buy a car. I’ve had extremely good and honest Audi’s over the years and I’ve had a few that think “dollars” first and patient/customer second. Do you really think everyone who works in the HA industry is a bunch of angels??? Well if your do please google Starkey and the millions the company paid after being sued for using faulty spare parts in hearing aids that needed to be repaired. But that’s another story.

In my case I had someone who said I’m either going to get paid $6,700 for two new aids (which just happened to squeal constantly) or I’m going to get $469 if the sucker doesn’t buy a different aid from me. You think I’m making up this story MDB for the fun of it ??? No I want others here just to be aware that when you test a new aids you should have the right tor return at NO COST, other then the services I pointed out earlier.

The HA industry in general has very little oversight and some what makes up the rules as they go along. Sames goes for hearing aid dealers. There are good ones and there are bad ones. Thankfully I’ve experienced more good Audi’s over the last forty years than bad ones.

#17

Hi Neville,

I bought a single hearing aid after finding the vendor in the yellow pages, that was in the south end of Mississauga. The lady was exceptional. However, she immediately left and went to a Doc, an ENT near Trillium Hospital. After she left things got bad. It was an in-the-ear hearing aid. They remade it because it squeezed when I chewed. It hurt! When I was stressed out I put it in my pocket. I did that a lot. I couldn’t hear in front in a noisy restaurant; I could hear talk 50 yards behind me very clearly!

I was referred to Lydia Kreuk by the hearing expert at work. She qualified me for hearing claim with Ministry of Labour. Her hearing aids were magnificent. Every time I visited her office I heard better when I left. Amazing audiologist. She sold her business to Listen Up Canada. It was a shell game. They misrepresented who owned the business. She didn’t know until they put up a sign!

I was referred again. I became a customer at a business in Brampton. It was a major business and they trained audiologist students or graduates there. I was there for 8 years. They sold me my second set of Phonaks, which never worked well. Both partners retired. The first one was my favourite. However, I had real trouble with work recognition, and I couldn’t hear at all behind me. I was almost hit by fast diesel loaders on construction sites twice that were passing me from behind. Same issue walking my dog on my street. No sidewalks. Traffic is fast.

When I complained they would turn up the gain on my hearing aids, and write on the submission to the Ministry of Labour that I had requested it. I just couldn’t hear.

My current audiologist is amazing. He works so hard. He’s been so generous. He put in a claim for me. It was successful; i got Phonak Audeo Paradise P90R’s. I had had the “Brampton” companies hearing aids for only two years! Ministry of Labour came through for me. I’ve had them for about a year and a half. I’mhearing quite a bit better now. However, it’s taken a bunch of visits and quite a bit of work.

The Lumity hearing aids came out about a year after I got mine. So I got state of the art hearing aids early!

DaveL

1 Like
#18

@Neville

Guess my question is

How does a new person find a good hearing aid provider?

And another,

How does a person find a good hearing aid provider when he needs replacement hearing aids? Maybe my methods were bad. I think that the Ministry of Labour may make things more difficult. When I hire contractors in business I always expect them to make a fair and reasonable profit.

Don’t mean to make you sad. I truly believe you provide excellent advice and service and I’m absolutely grateful that you provide so much help here.

DaveL

#19

Word of mouth, probably. How do you find a good doctor or dentist?

1 Like
#20

Thanks Neville. That works for some. I did talk to everyone that I saw with hearing aids on.

I ended up getting a referral at work for my first set of Phonaks and the audiologist was the best. However, she sold her business and I wish her a great retirement.

The next audiologist was a referral from the same source. However, I stayed too long. I was with them 8 years, and purchased a set of PHONAKS. I’ve described my issues in other posts here. I had trouble hearing.

I moved on.

My hearing gets worse every year.

DaveL

edit: I started wearing hearing aids 21 years ago. I’m 76 now. Maybe that’s the problem.

1 Like