Smart phone compatibility--reality vs what people want

#21

I’m still waiting for that ble hearing aid profile. I think that is what every Android manufacturer is waiting for too. None of them (apart from Samsung maybe) have the muscle to go proprietary like Apple. Actually, it’s annoying the hell out of me because my current aids are well past their use-by date and I can’t bring myself to buy a mfi anything.

Apart from my sectarian issues, with an open hearing aid standard you get the possibility of interoperability. Hearing aid apps from third parties? Yes, it’s not certain that ha manufacturers would relinquish control to that extent. Still it becomes a possibility. A BT5-connected hearing aid will have twice the bandwidth of current ble. That’s a big jump in audio quality.

I want it all basically. Music streaming from any source without any boxes in the middle. Control over volume and programs from my phone. And to top-it all off, self-programming from my phone if I choose to go that way. And I don’t want to be locked in to the same manufacturer for the life of my aids. That means an open standard.

Are you listening Santa?

#22

You won’t get a system where you can switch manufacturers for programming if that is what you mean. You might get some open source generic PSAP but hearing aid manufacturers tailor their programs to the performance of their aids. They are not going to make anything interchangeable or cross platform compatible. That would be detrimental to their shareholders and lose their R&D advantage/investment. That is just capitalism. Most open source systems will not have the money to get the same results in HAs.

What I want is
To hear well including in moderate noise.
Excellent features to handle everyday listening situations including complex listening needs, wind, auditoriums, feedback suppression, in the car etc.
To have the HAs be comfortable enough to forget I’m wearing them.
For the HAs to have good battery life - preferably 7 days.
Automatic adjustment of levels to accommodate user experience.
Low floor noise of the HAs, minimal delay.
Excellent dust and moisture/water resistance.
To stream from my iphone to my HAs without an intermediary device and without degrading battery life unreasonably.
To also stream directly from my iPad / iPod / tv / computer etc.
To use my iPhone as a remote control for the HAs.
For the HAs to work automatically all/almost all of the time but still have some control via the app when the odd occasion arises.
For my iPhone to be able to help me find my HAs/HA when lost.
Use geotagging for occasional special situations which recur but need particular settings - not for regular everyday use.
To be able to use the app on my phone to try out increasing or decreasing things like the noise suppression in certain programs without multiple visits to the audiologist - this would allow direct comparisons in real time in the same environment. And easy reversion to previous programming.
Comprehensive data logging - some of this accessible via the app.
For the manufacturer to give good support in a timely fashion to the audiologist when problems arise.

I’m sure I’ll think of other things I want in the future but all those things wrapped into one set of HAs would work for me. Before you tell me these things already exist remember that some of them are somewhat subjective and some are user dependent - like comfort. I have not found an aid which ticks all the boxes - yet! Maybe next time?

Of course it would be really nice if they were actually affordable also.

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#23

It’s a good list. Actually, going through your list I find myself wondering whether I’m getting too hung up on the whole Bluetooth/streaming thing. The purpose of a hearing aid is to simply to be able to hear better after all.

Remains to be seen whether manufacturers are prepared to open up their aids to third party control. They might even see it as a selling point. I’d be more likely to buy a hearing aid that wasn’t limited to just the manufacturer’s app.

See Two Pi announces unified technology for BLE-supported fitting | Two Pi. Not just a two-bit outfit either. Their ip is probably in the aids you’re using now.

#24

“The purpose of a hearing aid is to simply to be able to hear better after all”

My loss is severe and I don’t do music, yet the streaming feature in hearing aids is very important to me! It dramatically improves my ability to use my phone both with phone calls and with all other functionality that uses sound.

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#25

That pretty much explains it. IMHO getting everything to work together is not a matter of if, but when.

Consider Bluetooth 5 was announced in June of 2016. Samsung released products supporting it in April of 2017, Apple in September of 2017. Microsoft’s latest flagship product the Surface Book 2 will be released November 9, 2017 with Bluetooth 4.1.

The technology getting HA’s to work with all these things, is almost the same as what someone might want in wireless ear buds. I suggest that the market is much bigger than just the HA market. Those with vision will see the same and work towards the appropriate protocols and products.

For me, I accept that these things take time. If the latest and greatest, requires multiple expensive hardware upgrades, I will likely purchase a lower cost and lower featured option that will get me through 3-5 years of product life cycle and upgrade on an as needed basis rather than an as wanted basis. Unless of course the newest technology will make a fundamental change justifying the expenditure.

I listened to people complain for years about the difficulties of using a telephone with hearing aids (self included). After experiencing cell phone connectivity through a streamer I hear a major difference. I would have no qualms suggesting to someone that they simply get a cell phone and streamer (if needed) then cancel their land line after porting their number over to a cell phone.

#26

My hearing aids connect directly to my cheap LG/TracFone smartphone via bluetooth thus enabling me to actually hold a phone conversation with about 90% comprehension if the caller speaks distinctly. I can not use any other type of phone. I have no intention of buying any Apple product or carrying some kind of inbetween device around in my pocket. I can also use my hearing aids as my computer speaker via bluetooth…

#27

I want direct connectivity with my android phone like Audio B-Direct AND FM functionality to use in noisy group meeting situations.

So far no aid models seem to fit the bill and if I want to stream to my phone and have FM capabilities I need to accept the fact I’ll have to use an intermediate device.

I’m being overly picky probably - I’ll be a part time HA user. Have normal pure tone audiogram for my age but have CAPD. Finally got sick of it so got officially diagnosed and am currently on trial with Audio B Direct.

Might wait for the Connect Clip 3 from Opticon and try the Opn aid…

#28

Can’t you attach a Roger receiver to the Audeo B Direct to get the FM capability? Pricey, but I think possible.

#29

I wish! The Audeo B-Direct line is not compatible with any accessory besides the TV link.

#30

Ah, I see now. Yeah, if I wanted it all, I think I’d consider iPhone and either Resound or Oticon.

#31

I’m stuck with my current android phone (note 8) since I’m paying it off for next… 20 months. Also sorta die heard android user.

I might try Oticon Opn when/if the connect clip 3 comes out. Which means delaying purchasing and that’ll work out so I can use 2018’s FSA funds to pay for these. (In my infinite wisdom, I pull the trigger on whole official diagnosis and HA trial too late, since I just lost hearing aid reimbursement with my insurance when my policy renewed in September)

My Audi thought with the B-Direct the phone could be used as mic… Phonak seemed to think my idea of using the phone as microphone for FM-like feature was good idea when I reached out to them and the person I chatted with will forward my suggestion to the product engineering team.

The technology to do that exist in the phone and in the HA. I found few third-party apps that can amplify directly to the aid via the phone’s mic, but there’s a delay. So hopefully Phonak rolls out future upgrades to allow phone-as-mic (minus delay), especially since the accessory option is next to nothing compared to non-direct models.

#32

I haven’t really heard of anybody being happy using phone as microphone. Phonak’s Roger and Resound Multmic seem to be preferred solutions. There’s something on here somewhere about a guy with Multimic and Roger microphone on a Resound (Linx 3D I think)

Yeah, I’m not an Apple fan either, but if it’s an important feature, an Apple SE can be picked up for not much more than the price of a hearing aid accessory.

Then again with a Note 8, you’ve got Bluetooth 5 capability, maybe somebody will come out with a Bluetooth 5 hearing aid soon. Oticon, Resound or Widex seem like the most likely suspects to be first with Bluetooth 5, but it’s pure speculation.

Warning though, in noisy situations you’re still going to have to deal with the noise as I assume with a near normal audiogram that you’ll go with open domes.

#33

I have read this whole thread - now totally confused as to “what, if anything, is out there”.
I am on the phone, a lot, for business. For years before I got HA about 7 years ago - wore a Bluetooth headset. I have had no trouble using the BT while wearing the HA.
I sure would like to be able to dispense of the BT and some how use the phone to communicate with the HA.
Question - Is there such an HA in existence? I gather, in reading this thread, that Apple has something. I am vehemently opposed to using Apple products. Prime example - ALL phone manufacturers agreed to a charging port protocol years ago - except Apple. All our devices are “Google based” - from phones to the Google smart “Home” to the Google mesh wifi system in our home to Google video and audio streaming devices.
My HA (now almost 7 y.o. Phonak Audeo) are starting to show their age. If something is on the horizon, I’ll wait a year or two before getting new HA. I buy cell phones that are top of the line (Samsung or LG) every 2-3 years.

Thanks.

#34

Given that you want to stick with Android phone, the only hearing aid that allows direct streaming from phone to hearing aids is the Phonak Audeo B-Direct. If you’re willing to wear or carry a small device (either worn around the neck or clipped to a pocket, depending on manufacturer) several manufacturers offer hearing aids that will work.

#35

That is not correct. I have used these for over a year and found them to be the best solution for my profound hearing loss:

http://www.soundworldsolutions.com/store/hearing-aids/companion

#36

I’m very glad they work for you. You probably consider me quibbling, but I don’t consider them hearing aids. They seem to be very impressively featured PSAPs (Personal Sound Amplification Product) They do not appear to have the precision adjustability of hearing aids. That said, I can imagine them working well for somebody with a fairly flat hearing loss. Curious about battery life. I’m guessing the rechargeable battery is either pretty big or doesn’t last long since it uses standard Bluetooth.

#37

They are hearing aids. When new, the battery lasts about 12 hours. After a year’s use, I usually have to charge them in late afternoon…it takes about 30 min. What I find most useful is the Andorid app which I use to check on the volume setting and occasionally change the frequency response settings. I don’t care what they look like,

#38

@miket I’m trying out Phonak Audeo B-Direct and it does connect to my Samsung Note 8 directly and the HAs act as a headset.

My qualm with the Audeo B-Direct is lack of connectivity with other wireless accessory options Phonak offers like the Roger microphones for FM feature.

Also, I was slightly disappointed the hands-free bluetooth cell phone call options only streams to one aid, which in grand scheme of things isn’t really bad… I use my right ear almost exclusively for phone calls. (I have normal puretone audiogram but have difficulty with speech in noise/over phone due to CAPD) Supposedly other non-streaming aid act as a microphone.

Since the connectivity technology exists, I hope Phonak expands the streaming capabilities between bluetooth devices and the HAs. At the moment the B-Directs connects to phone or to the TV and some other bluetooth devices via TV Link. It’d be a shame to under utilize the first ‘made for all phones’ feature.

#39

Phonak Audeo B-Direct apparently range in price from $1400 ea to $2400 ea. I bought my Sound World Companion hearing aids for about $670 for the pair. I was so sick of my Hearing Health Center audiologists I would, at that time, try most anything. For that price, I could sell them on eBay and recoup most of the cost if I didn’t like them. But, they were so much better than my Audibel hearing aids there was no question of keeping them. The CS Customizer application on my phone works fine but the Personalize application within CS Customizer really does not work well for me. Currently my settings, after running the Personalize application, for both ears, are: Volume 4dB, Treble 4dB, Mid 3dB, and Bass -7 dB. So, the Bass is essentially turned off.

Finally, I can easily afford to buy any hearing aid on the market. I am a retired electrical engineer.

#40

@member6

I’m actually fine with how much the Audeo B-Directs will cost me.

With my specific needs, cheap devices will not be an option since I need HAs with a good speech in noise program.

Anyway - I was mainly replying to miket, since they were asking about direct connectivity to androids.