Oticon vs Widex for critical music listening

[:disappointed:A lot of my floppies are ripped, too.]

What type of headphones are you using?
You need Over the ear large cups that cover the entire ear & the hearing aid and then you’ll “hear” your headphones.

If you’re limited to On the ear phones, that follow what @Volusiano recommends & place the aids inside the cup.

From what I’ve seen from Oticon I doubt they ever will. I don’t think they give a damn about music listeners.
Sorry, but if you do some research, you’ll find Oticon to be one of the top recommendations for music.

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@flashb1024: As suggested by @Volusiano, the telecoil program works well with my cans. I’m not sure it works for all headphones, however.

Didja use the “SpudSoft Touch®” technique for said rips?

:pick:🪚Yes, I did as a matter of fact!:axe::hammer:

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Overall, I have not been satisfied at all with my hearing aids. I have the Oticon Opn S 1 miniRite since September 2019 and I am already at the 3rd in-warranty replacement. I had a few weeks ago a hearing test at my audi and the hearing aids adjusted accordingly. Regarding the Music program, it has been for me - a classical music lover - anything but useful. I was yesterday at a piano recital in a relatively small performance hall specifically built for that purpose: I ended up using the P1-General Program with the volume reduced to -3 to get a somewhat acceptable sound quality. When streaming a music program using my laptop with Bluetooth connection allows me at least to try to find a setting by selecting one of the programs and adjusting the Streaming Equalizer. I have given up listening to music streaming from the TV set and connected to the TV Adapter 3.0.

I trialled both the Oticon More 1s and the Phonak P90s when upgrading recently. Music reproduction was a big factor for me, and helped sway my choice in favour of the P90s. I haven’t regretted my choice, as I listen to more and more music, both live and recorded. I never expected ever again to be able to hear music with the clarity and purity I do now. LPs that I’d given up on listening to because the sound was so attenuated and even distorted I now listen to with pleasure (via a TV Connector hooked up to my audio system).

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(via a TV Connector hooked up to my audio system).

OMG, I never thought of that…It might be a game changer. I have packed all my music away. I have not listened to any music for more than 20 years…I’m gonna drag my LPs outta storage. and try…

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You don’t post your audiogram with your avatar so it’s hard to even guess why the Music program in your OPN S1 doesn’t work for you.

The built-in Oticon Music program is nothing magical. They disable the noise reduction on it and minimize any of the signal processing the HA normally does to help with speech in noise. The fact that you find the P1 default program more palatable to you for live music listening is simply an indication that your hearing loss needs some minimal signal processing, maybe more aggressive compression than the minimal provided by the Music program.

I personally find the P1 default program sounding very agreeable to me for music listening as well. The Music program just opens it up a little bit more than the P1 default program, that’s all. But I can hear music just fine with either. Again, without knowing what your hearing loss looks like, it’s hard to say or guess why the Music program doesn’t work for you.

Michael Fremer, on his Analog Planet (part of Stereophile), reviewed the Widex Moment 440’s in an effort to help his 90+ yo mother in law with a better quality of life. Fremer, 74, said he preferred the sound of his amazing audio rig with the Widex Moment 440’s.

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My audiogram confirmed my fear that 2 audio-related incidents contributed to some notable lower freq and higher freq hearing loss in my left ear, compared to what my 69.5 year old right ear hears. I can still hear voices quite well. but the audio image, without any aid, is now right-centric and no longer centered, high cymbals and the lowest bass notes are predominantly on the right.

I met with the Audiologist, who fitted me with Widex Moment 440’s but, with our meeting held in her temporary office, she had no music for me to judge them with. Frustrated and, at this point, unwilling to spend $6800 for the 440’s, which would be my first HA’s, a friend urged me to buy the Schiit Audio Loki Mini+ tone control. I installed it in my audio rig on the left channel only and was able to dial up the basics of what I was missing - all but the highest highs, anyway. I upgraded to their new Lokius tone control, because it has 6 EQ bands to the Loki’s 4 and provides both a balanced and unbalanced option. Both tone controls have bypass switches, useful if others visit who don’t have the same hearing challenges.

I listen to my own system 95 % of the time, and this has been a wonderful discovery… it has removed the pressure to jump into HA’s to quickly. I’ll continue to research HA’s until I’m ready to make the plunge. I do not work for the Schiit Audio.

One of the most respected names in HiFi gear, for sure.
The Lokius seems like a great bargain at it’s price point, too.
I remember reading Fremer’s review of the Widex’s some time ago.
He is a very reliable source of information.
If you could post a copy of your audiogram (you can access the details on your prfile page) it would help us to see where your loss is.

I suggest you google Marshall Chasen, who is considered the leading AuD for musicians.
He has some great info on hearing aids, and fitting for music.

Thank you for your reply and the helpful comments. I uploaded the latest hearing test result, I hope the details are readable and I am looking forward to your comments.AUD 07-2021.pdf (710.1 KB)

Thanks for making your audiogram available. Usually forum members just post it next to their avatar so that anyone can see and access it at any time at any thread/post. I’d suggest you post it up this way, because the way you just did it can only be seen if somebody happens to see that particular post only.

Anyway, why don’t you also elaborate on what you find wrong with the Music program specifically, instead of just saying that “it’s been anything but useful” for you? Is the music too tinny sounding? Is something lacking? Is something too much? And how is the P1 General default program better than the Music program for you when listening to that piano recital, or when listening to music overall?

Sorry, I had never uploaded anything before, so I hope if it worked this time.

When listening to music in a live concert using P3-Music, the sound is very tinny, metallic, “flat”, with almost no bass components, i.e. no lower frequencies. With P1-General the sound is slightly “richer”. Regarding streaming from my laptop and using the equalizer, I at least can try adjusting the Low, Mid and High settings which improves the sound quality a little bit, but the bass sounds are still quite quite weak. I have another appointment with my audi coming up shortly and may be there is a way to make some adjustments without affecting significantly speech clarity.

When streaming you will not get powerful bass from the output of the very small receivers. When not streaming I get good bass using vented domes. The bass is ambient sound combining with the output of the HAs.

You have quite a bit of hearing loss all the way through including the low frequencies starting at 500 Hz. It’s natural for you to find the bass lacking in any program. It’s easy to ask your audi to “customize” the built-in Music program further in the Fine Tuning -> Gain Controls section to add more bass so that it’s at least on par with the P1 General default program. But keep in mind that the receivers are tiny little speakers which can produce mid to high frequencies amplification OK, but they lack the physical size to give you the kind of bass you want to hear just because of this limitation. It’s not just Oticon, but any other HA brand/model will have this same physical limitation.

It’s not clear how you’re being fitted (open or closed bass dome, and what size receiver). If with open domes and 85 dB receivers, you can try to up the receiver size to 100 or 105 dB and also go with close bass domes. With the bigger receivers, ALONG with making sure your audi manually boost the lows a bit more to your satisfaction, and the close bass domes to help keep the sound from leaking out of the vents like with an open dome, you may be able to get more satisfaction out of your hearing aids.

For most people with the normal low frequency hearing with the ski slope loss starting at mid to high frequency loss, the open domes with large open vents allows the low frequency sounds to come through for them to hear normally and the mid to high amplified more to compensate for the sound leak in the mid and high. But you have mostly low frequency loss as well, so the close bass domes should work better in minimizing the sound leak so you can hear more of the bass like you want.

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The tiny receivers’ physical inability to “move air” is mostly overlooked in discussions about the “lack of bass” HA wearers often complain about.

There are workarounds - some would label them as kluges - but that’s not the reason why I posted this reiteration.

I just wanted to underscore the reality that no amount of tweaking of any maker’s fitting program can overcome a HA receiver’s inherent inability to “move air”.

My $0.02/FWIW

Flalshb1024 - I’ve been looking at my account and profile page and see no place tp upload a pdf of my audiogram…

@gregvoth and @deberh

https://forum.hearingtracker.com/c/forum-support/60