This is interesting to me, as just last Monday 11/18 I went to my audiologist to have my HAs adjusted to the closed domes hoping that it would help me hear a little better. I wear Signia Pure 13BT (2017) While there, I asked some questions regarding Frequency compression, from what I’ve learned here. She said I did not have it turned on and most of her patients didn’t like. She said I could try it and voile - she turned it on w/ computer. Nothing else. I’m finding I’m not caring for it and am going back tomorrow to have it turned off. Phone calls. and music are not good at all. TV is not all that great with it either. Things do sound a little tinny. Hearing my own voice does not bother me, which is from closed domes too.
This all started as I didn’t feel I was hearing w/ my aids as well as I should. Maybe my expectations are too high.
Maybe frequency compression would work for me IF my audiologist worked or knew how adjustments should be. I’m frustrated w/ her, but I am now tied to her since I bought them there.
Any suggestions?
Your loss in some ways is similar to what I have in my left ear. You are on the margin where a custom mold is needed to avoid feedback, when you are given full prescribed gain. Are you trying the closed domes or closed sleeves? The Connexx software is showing that closed domes are not good enough to avoid feedback, but the closed sleeves may be OK. It kind of depends how well they actually fit you.
The software does not suggest frequency compression for your loss. My fitter told me the same thing as yours. They really only use it as a last resort if the user cannot hear the higher frequency speech. I would agree that you are probably not a candidate.
I would ask for some closed click sleeves to try if you have not already. Another thing to try are different fitting formulas. There are three basic choices; Signia proprietary fit, NAL-NL2, and DSL v5. And if none of that works, you may want to think about custom molds.
If you want to see what other fittings would be like, post a new thread. I don’t want to drag this one down with Signia stuff. I recall we may have discussed options before in another thread…
Thank you, Sierra. When you say feedback - I’m thinking the squeaking noise like old HAs had. Is that what you mean ? I do not have any feedback w/ my Signia HAs.
The quick way to check for it is to hold your hands over your ears. Even with quite well set up aids that usually starts the feedback whine. When I had molds I could hold both hands over my ears and got nothing. Now with the closed click sleeves I can get a tiny amount that way. What you don’t know, unless the fitter has told you, is that they typically back off the gain to the extent needed to prevent feedback. That is where I am at, when I decided against the custom molds. They backed the gain off in my left ear.
With the Connexx fitting software that Signia uses there is a step called Critical Gain. It determines how much gain you can tolerate without causing feedback. If that critical gain test is saved then the fitting software will limit gain to avoid the feedback. My fitter told me that she believes the critical gain feature limits gain too much, so she runs it to see to what extent and where the problem may be but does not save the data. She then adjusts manually. The point is that your fitting coupling type will determine maximum gain. It may be lower than what the prescription for your hearing loss is. Bottom line is that there are two ways around it. Change the fitting type, or reduce gain, usually in the 3 kHz range. And on top of that the different fitting formulas will prescribe different gains. One formula may be OK, and another not. So those are options when doing fitting - different fittings and different formulas.
I have just ordered the Phonak 90 after an extended trial, but my hearing loss is not as severe as OP, and I’ve been wearing HA for almost a decade. What I found during my trial is that I could use the Phonak MyPhone app to select different programs and try different adjustments to them. This was useful to the audiologist in making adjustments to the automatic program. The various programs are very different, and very helpful.
If no one mentioned real ear measurement it can make a big difference ask your hearing aid specialist if he doesn’t have the equipment find someone who does. the domes can make a big difference to .I’m on my fourth set of ha have phonax I’m 74 years old happy with what I have
Hi everyone, I saw a few mentions in this post about “get back speech recognition”. Is that true that we can improve speech recognition? I have been told by multiple audiologists and my ENT that speech recognition is gone then it’s gone. It would not come back. Are word recognition and speech recognition are the same thing?
I have improved my speech understanding by find tuning my aids to hear as much as I can in the speech frequencies.
@bobtpanda: I think maybe your multiple audis and ENT were referring to your hearing loss when they meant speech recognition. Most people don’t regain the hearing they lost for sure.
Word recognition is understanding just one word uttered at a time, like in the closed booth test. Speech recognition is not word recognition. It’s a string of words that even if you miss a few or a lot of them, you still may be able to understand the context of the speech spoken via other cues.
I’m now on the second round testing with Phonak M90. I had the Oticon OPN S1 for a couple of weeks. They are also top HA, but somehow different. I have a couple of question for all the profis here. Both sets of HA were with REM adjusted.
- I thought if the HA are set using REM then are the amplification values nearly same. That’s by me not the case. I have in some frequencies even a difference of 15 dB (for example by 1 kHz 80 dB I have by Phonak an amplification of 16 dB, by Oticon only 1dB). Is that normal or is this a wrong measurement?
- With Oticon I can here some noises wich I can’t with the Phonaks (e.g. the button on the elevator makes a hich pitched beep while pressing; I can’t here that sound with the Marvels but with Oticon). My audi told me it’s because noice cancelation by Phonak. Is that also normal?
Thanks
For starters, I’m not a pro. Regarding #1: How are you determining this amplification difference? They would be equivalent only if they were both programmed to the same fitting algorithm. I find that unlikely. Your Oticons are likely programmed using VAC (I think that’s right–too lazy to look it up) and your Phonaks using Phonak adaptive. Regarding #2 I’m guessing it has more to do with how their (very different) frequency lowering systems are set up.
Not a pro.
There is so much more to programming hearing aids than REM. Many many settings that affect hearing results.
As mentioned the fitting algorithms used for Phonak and Oticon are probably different. That will have an influence on gains at different frequencies and volumes.
Looking at your high frequency hearing loss, frequency lowering technology would probably be very helpful. Phonak has one of the best frequency lowering technologies at this time. It’s all about how the aids are programmed. Take a look at my audiogram, I hear birds, beepers, alarms etc.
Your hearing results will improve with either aid you decide to use, it just takes time. Everyone is different about acclimating to hearing aids.
Thanks guys. I have the gain values because I own a Noahlink. My understanding was that everyone has a necessary amplification acording to the audiogram. To ensure that the correct amount of amplification is achieved the audi performes a REM and adjusts the fitting formulas according to your needs. I concluded that your needs are independent from your HA so the after REM you should be at the same level (e.g. at 1000 Hz you need 25 dB amplification for loud speech). And that’s no matter what HA you own. Maybe I’m wrong.
Generally I was positively surprised of Oticon. I loved the silence in the car, the music sound better, I could hear more sound samples, and the speech understanding was not worse than Phonak. But I have 3 major prblems woth them:
1 - Whistleblock by Phonak works perfect. I have a custom mold with 3 mm venting. No problem for Phonak, by Oticon feddback problems. Maybe I should try a smaller vent.
2. Oticon is made for IPhone. For an android user there is no direct streaming or phonecall. Not a big concerne although.
3. Windblock clearily better by Phonak.
If your audiologist used the same fitting algorithm for both aids, your assumption would be correct, but it’s pretty clear he didn’t. The algorithm determines what is “necessary.” There’s also the question with REM of how close is close enough. Ultimately picking a hearing aid is a compromise where you have to figure out what is most important to you.
Thanks for your explnation, it makes now sense. You are right , there are the proprietary fitting formula in use. I was just surprised that they show so big differences. 15-16 dB in some frequencies is a huge amount of amplification.
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The OPN S is supposed to have a better and new feedback prevention technology than the original OPN, but maybe because of the OPN open paradigm, it’s still more prone to feedback than other brands, especially considering your steep ski slope hearing loss, which should require aggressive feedback management.
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My personal experience with wind noise management on my original OPN (not OPN S) is that it’s really mediocre. So the OPN S wind noise management is probably the same. If this is important enough for you, you probably want to go with the Phonak.
Thanks for your answer. I managed now to reduce feedback by reducing the vent size. Feedback is acceptable, but he occlusion is more present. I know that by Phonak there is an option to reduce occlusion in the Target programm. I can’t find it by Genie 2. Is there no such an option?
Your better off trying to accept the “occlusion effect” then trying to “fix” it by using the software, as all it really does is drop the lower frequencies, but you may not mind this judging by your audiogram.
Yes, lowering the gain from 1000-1500 hertz down by a dB or two should stop or help occlusion.
So I could try to manually reduce the low frequencies to obtain the same result. I also observed that the Oticon fitting formula raises earlier the gain (I have amplification starting at 500 Hz) as the Phonak software. That can be the explanation why by Phonak the occlusion pereceptin is not so pronounced.