TV’s have equalizers, too. And I should imagine there is a “sound quality” output setting in the TV, too, or if you have the TV audio output hooked up to an amplifier, in the amplifier sound settings. We have a really old Yamaha amplifier and its output can be adjusted to sound like a small room, a large room, a theater auditorium, etc. So if you’re not getting the sound you want directly from room speakers, I’d also check your TV or amplifier sound settings. If you have other folks around or visiting relatives, etc., they could have messed with sound settings that are relevant to TV. If you are using a streaming device like the ReSound TV Streamer 2, I’d check the Sound Enhancer settings for that program/device in the Smart 3D app and make sure that somehow the sound levels aren’t out of whack relative to the relative amplification levels you’d prefer to hear. In my experience, the quality of sound can vary a lot from movie to movie or DVD to DVD depending on the sound engineering that went into making the film or DVD or Blu-ray disc. We were recently watching an old time movie from the '30’s or '40’s (in the 20th century!) and I really had to crank up both the volume and the treble for my old ears to enjoy the sound quality of the movie - so maybe the same sort of need to customize HA output to your ears depends on the item you’re listening to and with some HA brands there’s a lot of “Autosense” but with ReSound, the user may have to configure sound more themselves but then you can save a unique configuration as a Favorite to reuse as necessary.
I had my Jabra M&RIE connected to SmartFit via NoahLink Wireless and went through various settings while I was wearing the aid. As you are likely aware, Smart Fit allows you to hear your changes live. That way I was able to see how my usual experiences (TV, Conversation) would sound on different HA settings. I tried Audiogram+, NAL-NL1, NAL-NL2, and DSL5. I like the NAL-NL2 best. All my stereo components and TV go through my receiver via HDMI. All the settings on the stereo were the same for the tests.
I wonder if any differences in fitting algorithms perceived for the M&RIE receiver or M&RIE program settings relative to the supposed canonical differences between NAL-NL2 and Audiogram+(NAL-NL1) could be due to accidental or intentional changes in implementation by ReSound for the M&RIE receiver and M&RIE program?, i.e., they didn’t get something right or intentionally changed something for M&RIE? Or perhaps it could be like the Moon Illusion (the moon appears larger close to the horizon, particularly relative to nearby objects at the horizon in our view than it does to us high in the sky, even though it’s actual size is the same). Since gain in NAL-NL2 is adjusted based on loss of neighboring frequencies as well as for the frequency band being adjust, perhaps there is some perceptual effect from that sort of adjustment as opposed to what’s done for NAL-NL1, etc.
Nevertheless, Harvey Dillon is the expert. He was the head of the Australian National Labs when NAL-NL1 and NAL-NL2 were devised. In the 2nd Edition of his text on hearing aids(2012), he has a whole chapter on prescribing hearing aid amplification (chapter 10) in which he makes gross comparative remarks. Here’s what he says in general summary on page 317, top right, relative to the algorithms I’ve mentioned:
NAL-NL1 prescribes an average gain, across frequency, that is a few dB more than adult subjects prefer. (NAL-NL2 prescribes a lower overall gain than NAL-NL1). (perhaps he’s writing about medium or loud sounds or average sound level for broad bandwidth sounds ??)
…
DSL[i/o] prescribes a higher average gain than NAL-NL1. Not surprisingly then, it prescribes more gain than is preferred by adult subjects. DSLm[i/o] prescribes a lower overall gain than DSL[i/o] (I didn’t bother checking how that relates to DSL5, ~the most recent evolved verson of DSL).
It’s great to experiment with how input from your own environment sounds in your HA’s with different fitting algorithms. There’s also a very interesting set of sound files in the Common folder (…\Common\MediaSoundFiles of the Smart Fit program files). Try listening to the series of files related to the file name _ENmd+5lunch.wma. That one the speech is only 5 dB above the noise. And the one _ENmd+0lunch.wma, the speech is only 0 dB above the noise. Um_bongo has pointed out that such recordings are not real 3D sound to your HA’s but if you play it into room speakers, it might be an interesting test of how well your HA’s are working for you with different fitting algorithms. That’s what I used to decide which speech algorithm I liked best.
That went over my head like a flock of geese headed south for the winter. I’ll come back to this after I’ve read some more. Any thoughts on this: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1635502101/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1
Harvey Dillon’s book is a little old and not going to cover the latest digital aids.
I have that book. It’s strong on how hearing aids work (technical on the HCP level, not the engineering level), current HA features, and hearing tests and fitting procedures. But it doesn’t cover manufacturers’ fitting software. The writing style is intended to be entertaining, which some people might find distracting.
I found it to be weak on audiology and acoustics and physiology. For that I recommend Audiology Science to Practice, Second Edition by Steven Kramer. AbeBooks has used copies for less than $10.
Here’s what I said about Harvey Dillon’s book a while ago. The basics of hearing loss and hearing aid correction haven’t changed. DSP signal processing advances are just in the way the HA’s function to deliver sound recovery. I doubt any book is going to explain the “magic” of how any particular HA works as the OEMs are keeping that stuff to themselves as proprietary trade secrets, etc.
Then there is this nationally used text on audiology itself:
IMPORTANT NOTE ON KINDLE EDITION: Actually it turns out that the Kindle edition format isn’t so great for the pictures and the video available with the ebook. So in the end, I returned my Kindle edition purchase to Amazon and bought the etext directly from Pearson, which necessitates installing the Pearson app on a smartphone or using a web browser on a computer to read the book. But it does have some very nice illustrations and videos and sound media files, IIRC.
Martin, like Dillon, is a grand old man of the hearing/hearing aid world so as for Dillon’s work, his text may be petering out on updating, etc. The last edition was in 2018 - but then maybe such books don’t need to be updated that often?
A great free reference on hearing aid fitting, mostly about compression of sound loudness to restore hearing and how it works, is Starkey’s free downloadable PDF, The Compression Handbook:
@MDB very helpfully recommended the Dillon and the Martin and Clark books to me once upon a time.
I’ve read the Starkey pdf. It was a good start.
THIS is exACTly what I needed to read. I’m a classical musician and sound is important to me. I am also trying the MORE1. But… is you’re saying the sound of the Jabari is on par, then the extra 3k isn’t worth the spend. Ty. Very very much!
Curious to know what the fitting range is for the M&RIE? Would the M&RIE always be the better choice if your hearing is in the acceptable range? I was at Costco today and no mention was made to me about one or the other, i.e. RIE vs. M&RIE.
The Jabra is the same as the ReSound One. The data sheets posted here will show you the fitting range:
https://pro.resound.com/en-us/products/support-materials/one-support
There’s another thread here somewhere on the ReSound One M&RIE fitting considerations that includes additional detail:
Thanks for the quick response. I called Costco and was told that my hearing loss is such that the M&RIE would cause too much feedback. I also have small ear canals with a pretty sharp bend so it looks like it is not for me. I was only wondering because it is supposed to help with directionality and I have trouble locating sound so I thought it might be helpful. BTW, I’m in the northern VA area as well with a son who would appreciate your UVA reference!
Hello,I am also in the Northern Va area,there is a Costco in Manassas that has a hearing aid person that also has a hearing problem,she is pretty good,her name is AmyI have been to her twice now,but,still keep hopping these adjustment will work,she is helpful though in trying.
Thank you. I am seeing Wen in the Fairfax Costco. We’ll see how he does.
You are welcome,I have been to the Costco in Fairfax,but only saw Lidija Kirovska,I was not impressed with her at all! she would not listen to my concerns and did not give me much of her time ,she was rude. I would not see her again,if by any chance I would go back there. That Costco,is much closer to me then Manassas,but,I will stick with Amy for now. Let me know how you appointment went with Wen.
My first Costco experience was so unsuccessful that was considering returning the Jabras. jay_man2 had a ton of good information and experience with the Jabras, so I reached out. He recommended Amy, and my first visit with her was a revelation. Highly recommended [and thanks again jay_man2]. Cheers
Yes Tony,I was ready to give up too,I did meet with Amy a few times now,and decided to keep my Jabra’s also,just have to keep doing adjustments with her and we will get it right! still having problems with hearing my T.V. clearly,(voices) and and my gym.
I picked up a Noahlink, but haven’t yet started down the DIY tuning rabbithole. Soon will though. Amy is great, but being able to tweak and test the results may be better and she has given me a very solid base to work from.
Tony,what is a Noahlink?
It’s the device that communicates from a computer to your aids. It’s only about the size of a pack of cigarettes. You plug a cable from the Noahlink into a computer and the Noahlink allows you to wirelessly transmit from the computer Smartfit software directly to your aids, just like they do at Costco.