Hearing test with K7s

#1

I tried a on line hearing test. I could hear sound until the 4000 hz range then tried the test with Kirkland K7’s on and could hear sounds to the same 4000 hz range ( my wife was able to hear the sound past 8k) Should I be concerned that my aids are not working properly. I had sent them for repairs (05/06/19) and when returned did a hearing test and had a REM done. I never did a on line test before with aids so no comparison. Thanks for any and all answers.

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#2

I wouldn’t be concerned based on what you reported. More importantly, are you having any problems hearing? You don’t post your audiogram, but I’m guessing your hearing drops off dramatically after 4000hz range (like mine). Hearing aids can’t supply enough gain to make those sounds audible. If you really want to hear the higher sounds, you’ll need frequency lowering activated. I also have the KS7s by the way.

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#3

Thanks at 4000 hz at 60 decibels at 6000hz I’m at 70 decibels. I am hearing better with aid than without.
I was concerned not hearing at that level since I could hear that sound was not sure what I was missing in speech. Guess was caught off guard when I heard no sound ( wife did) since I thought the K7’s would provide to the 8k hz range

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#4

Thanks MDB I hit enter before finishing comments but wanted to thank you again for the education never heard of the ability to lower the frequency to better hear s words or high frequencies It’s always a pleasure to be educated

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#5

If you haven’t looked at a “Speech Banana,” take a look. At those frequencies you’d be missing the f, s and th sounds. You might be able to hear a little higher with conventional amplification. Remember if you start hearing sounds you haven’t heard in awhile, things will sound notably different and you may not like it. If you want more info on frequency lowering, there’s lots of resources. It tends to get pretty in depth.

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#6

Yes the KS7 should be able to go up to about 10 kHz according to this specification sheet. One thing you could ask your fitter at Costco is trying a different prescription. If your hearing aids and fittings are able to produce more high frequency without feedback you may be able to elevate hearing at high frequencies by using the DSL v5 prescription formula.

Not totally sure of the capabilities of the KS7 but I suspect it is possible for them to set up one of the programs to use DSL v5. Then you could take them home and see how it works for you. DSL v5 tries to keep the high frequencies instead of rolling them off like some other prescriptions do.

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#7

Thanks for the response. Main concern is wife voice starts strong then goes faint. The last time I did ask they merely raised the volume. I’ll check with Costco they seem to be hesitant about doing extra but was around when store mgr. was telling employee to do everything they could to accommodate customers ( it was at hearing and eye center) guess there was complaint in those areas. I do have to ask for the rem to be done. I have open domes an good hearing at 40deb. and 3000hz.I am 69 yrs.

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#8

If speech is the only issue, it only goes up to about 6 kHz. See speech banana below. You may only need to have your HA readjusted to bring it up to the typical NAL-NL2 prescription. It is not uncommon for fitters to adjust the level of amplification down for new users. You don’t want the volume just cranked up, you want the HA output brought back to the required prescription. NAL-NL2 should be good for speech, but to go beyond that DSL v5 may work better.

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#9

I had to go to Costco for my test results now posted. They tried to lower high frequency but seem to have lowered all; everything sound a little muffled. It was then lowered a little. There is no change on hearing tone or using hearbidsagain.com at the 5k level even with speakers at 100% was also told they only try to program to 6000 hz using nal nal2. I still lose certain voices and end up asking someone near me to repeat it. Also have trouble with cease pick etc. Would I benefit from a different HA other than K7 or seek a different programmer or lean to deal with what I hear. They did not do WRS but re checked REM. I have had K7 for 3 yrs. past audiogram only show slight difference in rt. ear and about the same left ear.
Thanks

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#10

Your loss is not all that different than mine, especially for the left ear. My issue for the left ear with KS8 seems to be feedback. It limits the amount of high frequency (4 kHz) gain they can use without it causing feedback. This was with vented click sleeves, and also with closed click sleeves. I am going in for fitting of custom molds this week, and won’t know for a couple of weeks or so until I get them, what difference it will make. I am hoping that is the solution. At least in theory you could also benefit from a custom mold with a small vent. Before going to a custom mold you could also try a closed click sleeve. They give them away and it should be no cost to try. If they fit well, and it is a big IF, they could give them more room to increase gain without feedback. For me the helped some at lower sound levels, but at higher level such as with recorded music they don’t seem to isolate feedback enough. But because they are a standard off the shelf item, the probably fit some people well, and others not so well. I seem to be in the later category.

I don’t think that their use of NAL-NL2 is a problem. DSL v5 would try to elevate the high frequencies more, but I suspect feedback would be the limitation no matter which prescription curve was used.

On a second thought, what receiver are you using? It should be stamped on the side of the receiver if you take it out of the domes. Maximum power if it is a S or M receiver could be an issue too.

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#11

It looks as a 2S stamped where 8mm open domes are. I have every size dome from 4 up tp 10’ open and closed even have tulips. I was using closed dome before sending HA’s off for repair twice in a 3 week period. after last repair did the posted ha test programed ha and did a rem, was told best to use open but I could use closed with minimal difference would not need re programed. I am somewhat fortunate my retired from employer has been giving me a allowance to expire this year for $5000 I pay the first 1200 they reimburse me the difference. Was talked into Costco foe ease of appointments and close to house most appointments in 3 days. I tried the test with closed no difference at 5k no feedback with either unless I put my very close to mic.

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#12

P.S they did not want to use any other prescription said it what they had rexton program the aid to

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#13

I had to re read your answer. I guess I was so wrapped up in me that I failed to mention that I wish you luck and hope the custom molds are the answer to your issues. I was so intent on being educated, I forgot about other that have issues just a 69 yr. old Sagittarian and living up to my symbol half man half horses ass. take care

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#14

Background. I also have KS7 and also have significant high frequency loss. I use the S receivers (lower power), Small vented click sleeves and self program. I’ve fine tuned the frequency lowering so I can hear up to about 6500hz.
That said, if I were you and had your insurance benefit, I’d be looking for a good audiologist outside of Costco and I’d be looking at Phonak Marvels because I think the do high frequency better than most, but many would debate that.
Options with your current aids: 1) Since you do ok with closed domes, try the M receiver and see if they can get more gain to the highs. 2) If no luck, they’d need to adjust the frequency lowering. It’s not a set and forget thing. For example, the software originally recommended a 5khz to 7khz setting for me. I’ve fine tuned it to 3.25 khz to 4.5 khz.

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#15

I don’t have a smart phone but wife does.( old school flip) Would I be able to adjust higher freq. with her phone or would I need a separate device and phone. Costco seem not to want to spend extra time. Hopefully there are instruction for the high freq lowering. As for insurance upon age 65 was forced into medicare, it was a 5 yr offer to help into retirement. only cost 32 yr. at Frito lay. Also back then pension and 401k was available along with small stock option (share power) at the time didn’t think much about it but now that I’m retired very glad I stuck it out. They no longer provide pensions or share power.
This is the last yr. to be able to get $$$$ for HA. I am wanting to spend their money as close to yrs. end to have the warranty on new aids last a few months longer. Since I have the K7’swanted to get the most value out of them and keep as a back up. Was told that the K9 would most likely be resounds. I guess I could see if they have a k8 m receiver I could demo in store not sure if that would be helpful or not. I have been looking on line for a good audiologist near me hard to tell which would be good must reviews 3.5 to 4 rating

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#16

Adjusting the frequency lowering is not something you could do with a phone. It would require roughly $300 in equipment and a significant learning curve.

If you want to get the most out of the KS7s, Ask for the medium receivers and the unvented click sleeves. That should get you something suitable for at least backup.

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#17

The S receiver should be OK for the right ear, but comes up a little short for the left ear. Here is what I see for your loss on the fitting range chart:

Is it possible you have a different receiver in the left ear? Here is what the loss looks like on a P receiver. The M receiver comes up just a touch short for the left ear too. Note that it is suggesting double closed domes for fitting.

First Fit with S receiver, Open Domes, and NAL-NL2

First Fit with molds, P receiver, and NAL-NL2. Note that you have much more room under the gray area of maximum output. The software calculate the right vent at 2.5 mm and the left vent at 2 mm. Those are not super small, so you may get away with a closed click sleeve for feedback. It is theoretically a 1.6 mm vent size equivalent.

Hope that helps some.

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#18

What would it cost to change receivers in a k7? Not sure at 2.5 years it would be changed free. That is something I should look into for new HA. unless cost would be minimal.

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#19

One pressure point you could try is to ask them to show you your loss on the hearing aid fitting graph (like I have above). If the loss was off the chart when they supplied them, you could argue it was their mistake and they should pay. Not sure what the cost is though. If it is your hearing that has changed then the argument becomes a little weaker…

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#20

Another thing you could do is ask them to do the Critical Gain test for feedback potential with your current open domes, and then again with closed sleeves to see if there is a reduction in feedback potential. If there is then you could ask them to use more gain in the REM curve fitting. As you can see in the first fit curves they should be applying gain right up to 8 kHz.

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