Getting Fitted for Starkey Evolv AI 2400 CIC Tomorrow. What Should I Know?

Hearing Aids
#21

I’ll definitely keep at it. I felt I was being a nuisance with the first couple of trials but the audi reassured me that it is long process to 1) find the right HA, and then 2) to set it up correctly and takes multiple visits.

The only reason I can think of for this is that as these are Starkey’s and the new ones are also Starkey’s then perhaps the set up can be carried across? Not sure, but I did kind of get the “well Starkey have made these customised devices just for you, so you may as well give them a spin” vibe from her.

#22

It doesn’t seem like a waste to me. The hearing aids are going to be very similar. You trying them 1) gives you time to adjust to the gain and 2) helps to teach the audiologist more about you. Plus, what if you end up loving the IIC and hating the CIC.

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#23

They didn’t work well with me, they could never get the feedback out, “after multiple attempts and send backs”the level I needed to hear with them turned into frequent feedback, imo Starkey’s need to concentrate on hearing before attempting all the bs health options such as steps, fall alerts, translation “which sucks “ I have a watch for that, and on that subject you cannot adjust the Starkey’s on your Iwatch, I’m pretty sure their in a pissing match with Apple

#24

What’s the latest on this?

#25

Hi Scott,

Sorry for the slow reply.

So I went back to the clinic last Thursday expecting to give back the IIC and the CIC BT would be waiting for me; however it seems once again something got screwed up and they hadn’t arrived. Audi called Starkey who checked and said they didn’t have the order. Audi asked them if they resent it then how long will we have to wait; Starkey said that at the moment it is taking 3 or so weeks.

So short story, I have the IIC for another month until the others arrive. While there I got the audi to make some adjustments - my own voice was too loud and everyone tells me I’m almost whispering when I talk (now they know what I feel like when people speak to me!!) so that was adjusted down, and I also got the volume knocked down to about 90% as I found I was getting a little overwhelmed with things so loud.

I was at a very large family function the prior weekend and had downloaded the Starkey T2 app. I changed the memory to the Noisy setting before I left home, thinking this would work well - background noise would be lowered but speech from those close by would be clearer. It was the exact opposite - I could not hear a single word from anyone standing right next to me (and I mean not a single word - without any exaggeration), but I could hear everything else going on. Luckily I was the photographer for the night and I could pretend I was too busy concentrating on taking the photos, rather than offering everyone a blank stare. I told the audi this and he made an adjustment - according to what he saw on the programming one or two parameters had been either set wrong or left in their default state (sorry, I can’t remember what specific parameters he mentioned).

I also found the left HA was slipping out of my ear - a few times during the function it almost completely fell out. It hadn’t done this since I got them 7-10 days prior, which is a bit weird. Again I mentioned this to the audi and he said the CIC should be a bit tighter as the shell will be a little bigger to accommodate the electronics, but to be on the safe side he took another mold, but this time with my jaw open. Apparently with the jaw opening and closing all the time they can work loose.

Cheers,
Richard

#26

Thanks for the update. Hope your order finally comes in!
What did you end up doing with the fishing string? Did you mold it into a curve to fit nicely or is it an antenna out the side?

#27

I hope it comes in too! But on the plus side it will give me a total of about 5-6 weeks with these IIC devices.

These IIC don’t have too long fishing strings - they don’t stick out as the devices are so far in my ear. It will be a whole different story though when the CIC BT devices arrive. I mentioned to the audi what Neville had said re applying some heat and bending. He said he will take photos of my ears once I have them and talk to Starkey about it.

#28

Thought I’d give an update on where I’m at with this.

The order for the Starkey CIC BT was cancelled by the audi - he’d done some more checking into them and he said the antennas on them were long and very noticeable and he knew I wouldn’t like them, so he changed the order to the CIC NW. I was a little pissed as I did want to see them for myself, but after seeing Dr Cliff’s YouTube video on them the audi made the right decision on my behalf.

The CIC NW arrived and I’ve been wearing them for the last 6 weeks. They are discreet and sit deep, but for the first 2 weeks I had excruciating pain in my left ear. I’m guessing it was my ear adjusting to the sharp bend in the mold and the size of it. It has settled down now and only very occasionally hurts (having said that it is hurting tonight for the first time in a couple of weeks).

Last weekend I went to a restaurant and had my CIC NW in, but I could not hear a damn word the wife was saying despite her being 3 ft directly in front of me. The HAs were picking up every sound around and behind me and she could see I was getting real uncomfortable with the noise. When I told the audi this he made some adjustments today to reduce the radius of the background noise and lift the voice frequencies. Hopefully this will work.

We had discussed the Phonak Virto P-312 previously and I was keen to try them, given they are wireless and Phonak apparently has great BT and “brilliant speech understanding”. They were duly ordered…and finally arrived today after 4 weeks. When he showed them to me, I couldn’t get over how big and noticeable they were - I was surprised because all the pictures and videos I had seen of them, they didn’t appear that big. It was disappointing. He gave me a couple of other options - to try the Starkey CIC titanium, but I’d lose the BT and wireless functionality; or try the Starkey ITC which is also bigger than the CIC (obviously) but not as big as the Phonak’s. He said they come in a rechargeable version but he will ask the lab to prioritize size over the rechargeable functionality.

My head is swimming with the choices and the big list of pros and cons for each. It is confusing as hell (and overwhelming TBH). From my understanding the Phonak’s have better connectivity since it uses BT classic and you can connect to multiple devices (a big plus for me as I am often on a work phone, Teams calls on laptop, and my personal phone), speech intelligibility is better (is it?), and the app is better, and my clinic offers a “pay as you go” option with this brand. Cons - they are big.

As I understand it the Starkey app is nowhere near as good and the BT is flaky - and because it is BT LE I can only connect to one device at a time. Speech is also not as good as the Phonak (can anyone confirm?), but they are smaller (slightly). For this brand I do need to shell out $5500 from my own pocket to top up the $3900 government contribution as there is no pay as you go for this brand.

Would be interested in hearing other user’s feedback/impressions - good and bad - for both the Phonak Virto P-312 and the Starkey Evolv ITC rechargeable and non-rechargeable versions. How good is Edge mode and speech on Starkey? AutoSense on Phonak? So many questions…

Thanks.

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#29

You and I are in the same situation. I have been a CIC wearer for over 20 years. I was at first excited about the Starkey Evolv AI 2400 CIC but after seeing the reviews, the goofy antenna, and the many complaints of poor bluetooth connectivity I had to pass on them. I tried Starkey’s bluetooth add-on years ago with the SurfLink Mobile and it was horrible so it sounded like Starkey is still far behind on bluetooth tech.

I went ahead and bit the bullet and ordered a pair of Phonak Virto P-312 in the half shell, they should be in next week. I’m not thrilled about the larger size to get into bluetooth, but it appears to be crammed full of tech to help me out in noisy crowds, on the phone, and in meetings which are all apart of my job. I felt like the pros of the good Phonak bluetooth and added tech heavily outweighed the larger size. Hopefully my results are in line with my expectations, so I’ll found out next week.

My hope for the last 3 or 4 years has been that Phonak would be able to add bluetooth to their Titanium CIC, especially now in an effort to compete/beat the Starkey Evolv AI 2400 CIC, but I couldn’t wait any longer.

#30

Hi Richard,
I tried the Starkey Livio AI2400 ITC/R for one month and was happy with them. Heard about a coming up Evolv so returned them.
Then I tried the Starkey Evolv 2400 ITC/R and I was very happy to have waited. The Edge mode does a good job as you can tap to instantly let them adopt to the situation you are in and voice recognition was better.
As I waited very long for the Starkey Evolv I tried the Phonak Paradise P90/R RIC in the mean time to see if Phonak RIC would suffit. But I decided that I would rather have an ITC and waited for the Evolv after all to come. Must say that the Phonak helped me pretty well in hearing better voices than maybe even the Starkey and the BT connectivity was better. But that could also be because of antenna in the canal and behind the ear difference.
After all I will give the Phonak Virto Paradise P90 312 a trie now and they will be there in a couple of days. So I’ll post what the differences for me were. Anyhow the Starkeys are really small, don’t know yet about the new Phonak ITC.
I have a high frequency hearing loss left more than right and am a classical music lover who streams a lot. So the battery vs rechargable will give me longer days as the rechargable battery lasts not the whole day for me. And in the mean time I am wearing my Phonak Marvel P90’s rechargable with customized earmolds. Speach recognition could be somewhat better as I experienced by trying the Starkey Livio en Evolv 2400’s custom made ITC’s. And I miss a bit the Starkey Edge mode as with the Phonak I can only know by opening the app on my mobile phone to see in which programm I am and eventually adjust it myself.
Wish you succes in your decissiontaking and hope to have given you some information as I felt.

#32

Hey there Scott,

Good to hear from you again!

Like you I was really excited about the Starkey CIC and thought it would be the perfect solution for me, but after seeing the complaints and the giant Teletubby antennas I was really disappointed. I’m getting fitted tomorrow for the Virto P-312 and like you I am definitely not thrilled with the larger size but it seems I may have no choice if I want the BT and wireless. Will be interesting to compare notes since we will both be getting them around the same time.

Nirvana would be the titanium shell crammed full of heavily miniaturized and powerful electronics, giving us reliable BT and wireless electronics, right?

#33

Hi @emile.heilbron,

Thanks so much for your feedback. It seems we are both in the same place at the moment with trialing the same models - it’s a shame one of us isn’t a few weeks ahead of the other so we could share our experiences so the other knows what to expect.

It sounds like the Starkey Edge mode is a huge plus and works very well versus the manual adjustment of the Phonak’s via the app.

Your post is very helpful and I really look forward to hearing about your experience with the Virto P-312. I’m really torn at the moment - the Virto has better connectivity but are so much bigger and noticeable; the Evolv is smaller but has dodgy connectivity and the Edge feature seems to work really well.

As mentioned the Phonak’s have a pay as you go option with my clinic which also gives me an upgrade to the latest tech every 3 years, whereas with the Starkey’s I’ll have to shell out $5500 to top up the government/Health Dept contribution and then do the same again in 6 years time when my next entitlement is available.

Thanks!

#34

Exactly! Then there would be no question about what you and I would get if that existed!

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#35

Unfortunately my audie called me yesterday my Phonak’s Virto P90 ITC arrived but he has no time to fit them until next week Thursday! So I’ll wait.

I did not try the CIC’s because they miss the connectivity so are not ment to be used for streaming music etc. But they are really nice small/ almost invisible.

The Starkey Evolv AI 2400 ITC are my favorite indeed because of size and Edge future. They fitted great in my ears and did a good job.

Now I heard the Phonak ITC should be a lot bigger I get a bit worried as I could imagine that the connectivity will not be a lot better. But I must say the Phonak Paradise P90 BTE did a great job in remembering 8 BT connections and connected 2 at a time (for instance mobile phone and PC, tablet or TV.

Well finally the goal after all will be speech understanding, after that speech in noise and on the third place my streaming wish. Maybe the aesthetic aspect has to be on the fourth place.

In a couple of years we hope the CIC’s get also BT and streaming.

One more thing about difference between the Phonak and Starkey. The Starkey has more channels for fine tuning the frequencies and also a wider Herz range in the upper zone. Do not know if that would be really an advantage for someone like me with high frequency loss though.

#36

Mine have been ordered and will arrive next week, however I did ask my audi to push the appointment out for another 10 days so that I can have a 2-3 week trial of the Phonak Virto P-312

The P-312 are BIG. Pairing them to my phones and laptop was easy and they automatically switch to whatever device I’m using, which is good. If I go to answer a call on my work phone then they switch to it; if I make a call on my personal phone then they switch.

So far, the Phonak’s have been good - the sound is a lot more natural than the Starkey CICs I trialled. I was surprised at just how different they sounded. My own voice sounds more natural and not robotic like it did before. Sounds are also not as sharp and shrill - for instance, water running from the tap, the kettle boiling (with the Starkey’s all I could hear was the noise from the kettle and nothing else but the Phonak’s almost completely remove it), paper rustling sounds more natural instead of very sharp, typing sounds are not loud. I’m really quite impressed with the sound. I’ve got the myPhonak app to play around with everything but my audi advised me to leave them on Auto as much as possible and let the HAs figure everything out. I’m still having difficulty with voices, but will try and adjust some of the sliders in the app and see if I can make it better.

A couple of minor things I’ve noticed with the BT - when answering a call by pressing the button on my right HA, the call is connected but it is still ringing/vibrating on my Apple Watch. It’s like the watch doesn’t know I’ve answered the call. the only way to stop it is to hit the END button on the watch. The other thing is that sometimes when I am in the car the audio suddenly connects to my HAs instead of playing thru the car. A little weird but it has only done it twice in the 5 days I’ve had them.

They are also comfortable too - I barely notice they are in my ears. Will be interesting to see how the Starkey’s compare to them. I’ll be sure to post more as the days go by.

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#37

@richard.silver.
Thanks for your additional info. You make me really curious about my upcoming findings. Two more days to go before my appointment is scheduled on Thursday.
Unfortunately, it has been some time since I tried the Starkey Evolv 2400 ITC, so a good comparison will be difficult. I think you did well by pushing out your appointment to give it a good try for now.

Your own voice experience will without doubt also have to do with the occlusion by the molds and the venting they prepared for you on them. That’s one of the negatives in using molds in stat of tulips I imagine.

I also noticed that there was a big difference in sound experience between Starkey and Phonak. But that may also vary subjectively from person to person, just what you like and how your ears interpret it. And the audi is able to adjust some things for you also. As using them for a longer time will do a big thing also as you get used to the translation you ears and brain will make for you.

What interests me most is what remains of speech in noise with the Phonak virto P90. I remember Starkey Evolv ITC did a good job for me. I also could listen to the TV boxes during eating (without BT connected). A lot depends on where you lost frequencies are in the speech area. So what works for you will not necessarily work for another person.

My experience with the connectivity with the Phonak Marvel 90 and Paradise 90 BTE RIC’s is that you have to set in the app yourself whether you want to have the sound through the HAs or through the speakers/boxes of the sound system. When the BT connections are registered/ known the connection will be made nearly instantly. But that also applies to the BT telephone connection. If for instance a train passes, the other party can hardly understand me anymore if I use the two-way BT while calling. Then I have to wait for the train to pass or quickly turn off the phone BT and use the phone microphone which works better at that time.

Another thing is with the streaming/ power up time which will be better with the Paradise 312 version as the rechargeables from Starkey will not be able to work the whole day long. You will need to charge them in between so you will have to carry the charger on the go. My pockets are sometimes to small to carry my keys, glasses, cards etc. Two batteries will then easier to carry as a charging case.

Quaint is though that the Phonak ITC will be bigger then the Starkey ITC as I thought batteries would need less space.

Enjoy your Phonaks for the time being.

#38

@richard.silver
Hi Richard how are you getting along with your experiences?
I now have tried my Phonak Virto P90 for almost two weeks and can now give some of my findings.

I like the fact that my batteries last about more then 2,5 days in contrary I used to reload my Starkey Evolv 2400 ITC at the end of the day already. (I do stream a lot from mobile phone and tv which sucks the batteries).

The Phonak Virto, which I ordered with an extra volume- turn knob. I really like the possibility to easy fast change the volume without first having to start the app on my phone. Very useful if you enter a stark changing volume area, a shop or a street or whatever.

The Phonak is bigger I think because of the volume turn-wheel in diameter. I assume that if you leave out this turnwheel it will be smaller maybe comparable to the Starkey. Also the Phonak is flatter/ less pronouncing out of my ear.
So giving me less wind noise with the Phonak Virto. And also the Starkey has 3 copper battery electrodes on the surface where the Phonak only has no discolored items on the surface.

For me the sound from the Starkey was a bit warmer where the Phonak sounds more sharp/ crispier. I have the impression that is also why I think I can better hear voices with the Phonak. But voices in noise ,I cannot remember enough the Starkey, stays problematic for me. But if not to much noise around I feel like a spy walking around on the street and hearing what people around me are discussing without them knowing I hear everything! Even turning the volume knob to hear them even better.
Impression of listening to music is that the Starkey gave me more satisfaction… although remembering so long ago is very difficult. And I am a big music fan but for me speech is most important. I could always still use fine headphones to hear basses more pronounced.

The connectivity with BT from the Phonak is much better then the Starkey I had. It takes a while for my mobile phone to connect that could be faster… but I assume that would cost a lot of battery usage extra. If one of the HA’s run out of battery connecting to change programm by phone though did not work correctly.

The high frequency range of the Starkey which is higher than in the Phonak I could not hear the difference. Assume that has to do with my high frequency loss.

Phonak does a good job in finding out and changing the settings in the automatic mode if there is loud or quiet environment or f.I. music etc. I hardly change the program myself as it is not needed and streaming automatically connects also.d I could hear everything perfectly.

Using the cellphone gives a better two way sound for the one who is calling I had the impression. An

What I also like very much in the Phonak is that I can change the balance of volume between environment and my phone streaming. Unfortunately I do not know anymore if this was possible withe Starkey.

At last the Phonak does not have the gadgets like health and translating speech what is a pitty. But I wonder if this fails me as I use my smart watch to watch the time and steps I walked. My hart rate is not that important to me although even that is visible on my watch.

Concluding:
I would really like to try out the Starkey once more but as this is not an option I think I prefer the Phonak after all because off:

  1. Connectivity BT
  2. Fast volume changing.
  3. Possibility to balance volume between streaming and environment.
  4. Longer lasting power
  5. Very good voice recognition.
  6. Better wind noise reducing.
  7. Good fitting in ear.

If any questions left I would be glad to answer and looking forward to your opinion and findings.

#39

The Phonak Virto uses the own microphone during a phone call. Is it possible to reduce the environment noise in case this is excessive?

#40

Unfortunately not.

:slight_smile:

#41

In addition to my long post three days ago, as I saw that the richard.silver did not respond till now, I wanted to add something I really mis on the Phonaks what was present in the Starkey:

Starkey has a test mode of the HA’s which is great and Phonak does not have it. My hearing with the Phonaks was impaired, and I suffered two days on bad hearing without knowing what the problem was! The Starkey would have told me immediately after starting up that the problem was at the speakers. And you can run the test in the app if you struggle on something. I changed the waxfilters in my Phonaks and solved the problem.

Phonak has a lot of sounds, f.I. when you change program or volume or when battery is getting low. I will learn it, I hope soon enough. But I better liked the Starkey telling me in words that I use music program or whatever and telling me battery almost empty instead of counting beeps.

And as zebra already says no you can not turn down the microphone volume if people cannot hear you at a phone call. But I have the impression that the Phonaks do a better job in a phone call in noisy environment. Although I cannot test nor proof it.