Is it possible to have a custom setting in Myphonak, so they are like the Bose headsets … Im flying soon and will not want to hear drone of plane engine you get on planes
On the myPhonak app there are fine tuning setting you can adjust to achieve this goal. Start by pressing the 3 lines on the bottom of the app to access the fine tuning settings, you can press the comfort tab at the top and increase the noise reduction to max (and even decrease loud sounds under Dynamic). Once done you can save the settings and it can be accessed under your AutoSense 3.0 home tab.
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Bose uses phase inversion for its noise cancellation. Hearing aids can not do that the way Bose does. Bose is built for one purpose only, hearing aid are built to work in many different environments. You can certainly make the noise more tolerable but don’t expect the same noise cancellation that you can get from Bose.
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Going back to the Audiology Online course that I took on ReSound noise reduction, I see that ReSound uses “spectral subtraction.” It would be interesting to know what the different means HA OEM’s employ and their relative pro’s and cons. https://www.audiologyonline.com/files/event/29700/29702/aoresoundntiiwindgaurd.pdf
i spend a ridiculous amount of time on airplanes just flew half way around the world and spent a lot of time playing around with settings. streaming and noise cancellations on marvels is almost as good as bose.
what i couldn’t do is connect to the airlines entertainment system using my usuall bluetooth transmitter. maybe the tv thing would work.
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That is most interesting. I have been looking for a hearing aid solution matching Bose’s Hearphone solution. When you say “almost as good as bose”, does that mean that the Marvel is actually providing active noise cancellation in the lower frequency range? Or are you using a closed ear piece providing passive noise cancellation and the hearing aids noise cancellation rather avoiding amplifying background noise?
active noise cancellation would be a very cool feature for them to add.
They have mics and they have an amplifier and what seems to be a very good processor. Seems like it wouldn’t be such a leap…
but like others have said, tuning down or muting might work almost as well for some folks, depending on their loss.
maybe try a neckloop if you have t-coil. It would be interesting to see how much interference the aids would pick-up
thanks I will give that a try using MyPhonak … i dont have the T-coil model
Phase inversion has been used in hearing aids for quite a while. But it is used in their feedback management systems and is very effective. When I fly, I find Westone high fidelity earphones (ear buds) with a solid compressible foam tip works the best. It knocks out all the ambient noise and I can plug into my computer, IPOD or the plane’s entertainment system.
@gorgeguy
Do you know whether phase inversion is used only for the feedback management or do some manufacturers actually allow a negative gain in the basic setting of the hearing aid (e.g. negative gain at lower frequencies, positve gain at higher frequencies)? Or even the possibility to set compression in the sense of having a positive gain at low volumes and a negative gain at high volumes?
I can’t give a definite answer to your question. I am retired now and don’t follow the “new” technology quite as close now, but I would guess that “negative gain” is not something used currently. Since we deal with hearing loss, we can go to no gain or more gain where we want it. Negative gain is not where hearing aid manufacturers have concentrated their efforts. Caveat “this is personal opinion based on 43 years in the industry”.
I was streaming from iPhone using the free JetAudio equalizer app. Also I have closed power domes. Marvel 2.0 app lets you boost the stream and shut down the mikes so like the hearphones and “almost” as good. Very close.
I don’t understand the neck loop telecoil thing.how would that work? I used to have rextron aids with the neck loop and could wire the loop to the airline jack but the sound was terrible.
What about my tv adapter idea? Most airlines have usb connections for power near the entertainment system jack.
For airline noise suppression, how do those of you fare who have severe hearing loss? Can you just take out your HA’s and get therapeutic quiet?
If this is the case, you could use the subtractive noise suppression in the programs.
Even with moderate loss, if you have earmolds or power domes you can probably get enough passive noise suppression to use the noise abatement in the programs to try achieving conversation with noise suppression.
But I don’t think this generation of HA’s will ever have phase-cancellation suppression that the Bose has. You need microphones situated right at the speakers or directionally in-line to get phase cancellation to work, AFAIK. I don’t think the displaced position of the HA mics will work.
I’ve often wondered why they don’t put mics on the back (outward side) of the receivers. Except that it probably would have massive feedback in most cases. But it would be a way to harness the phase information of the outer ear anatomy which employs natural directional encoding in phase information.
neck loop telecoil thing - well it sounds like you do understand it and have done it in the past…and yes, based on my very limited experience with it I’d imagine the sound would be terrible through the t-coil neckloop… but I thought it might be a way to connect into the sound system without using bluetooth (or other wireless transmissions)
…which points to my question about your tv adapter idea… doesn’t it transmit by bluetooth or something like it? Aren’t you supposed to go into airplane mode, shutting down bluetooth when on an airliner?
the rextron neck loop is bluetooth not telecoil. airplane mode doesn’t shut down bluetooth.
In the USA you’re allowed to use Bluetooth on the airplanes. Phonak TV Connector uses AirStream which is a fundamentally different protocol from Bluetooth but it uses the same frequencies and same power levels and will be indistinguishable to the airplane. Don’t tell the cabin attendants, because they’ll tell you to shut it down if they don’t know exactly what it is.
So as I’m writing this, I’m asking myself, if airplane mode doesn’t shut down Bluetooth, what is airplane mode for, anyway? It may be different in Marvel than in Rextron, but the only thing I could think about that airplane mode could do was to shut down Bluetooth. What else is there?
Is the mic position really so critical? A 1 kHz sound has a wavelength of 34cm, so I would think a as long as the mic is within a few cm, an approximate phase information should be preserved, at least for the lower frequencies (where most of the noise cancellation will be required). But yes, at higher frequencies, the mic position may become more relevant. So my feeling is the reason for HA’s for not having (or do they?) active noise cancellation is the feedback issue with open domes. And with closed ear molds, probably people don’t see a need for active attenuation.
In any case, if someone should be aware of any HA model providing active attenuation (or “active noise cancellation”), I’d be happy to hear who is offering that.
Well I’m happy to say I didn’t know about the rule change… I used to travel a lot for work, but haven’t in a long time… that makes me happy!
Not that it matters much but it’s probably up to the airlines and not a national rule/law. Last time I read the FAR’s, it’s up to the operator to determine that an electronic device doesn’t interfere with anything. I can’t imagine that this has changed…but I can imagine that all the airlines have determined that it’s ok.
But yes, haggis is right. It says right in the Marvel manual that airplane mode shuts down Bluetooth.
Are you sure that it doesn’t need to be shutdown for takeoff and landing, but maybe ok while enroute?
I could be wrong, but I’m thinking it’s both.
bluetooth connection to the phone or whatever, then induction neck loop to link with the T-Coil in the aids.
Yeah, good thinking. I haven’t really analyzed the physics of phase cancellation, but in the commercial products I’ve seen, the mic has always been very close to the speaker to have the best chance of preserving phase relationships across the frequencies.
BTW, most noise cancellation is done in the low-to-midrange frequencies. The high frequencies are really hard to predict and cancel.
And so, if there is any offset from the mic to the speaker, I’m thinking that it lets sounds sort of get “in between” them so that it would be impossible to predict the phase relationship because you’d need more 3D information about where the sound was coming from. I’m thinking that if the mic is right next to the speaker, or right in line with the path of sounds into the ear, it’d be easier to predict phasing.