Auracast and purchase of hearing aids now

Hearing Aids
#1

Hi all,

Apologies if this has been covered.

Does anyone know if Phonak Lumitys are likely to support Auracast (either via firmware update to the HAs or implementation via an intermediate “protocol converter” (since an intermediate device like a phone will certainly be required)?

I looked up the Auracast specification FAQ which says somewhat ambiguously:

“Will existing Bluetooth devices be able to transmit or receive Auracast™ broadcasts? Or will new software or hardware be required?
The new specifications allow for upgradability of existing products in the field. Whether field upgrades occur will depend on the underlying Bluetooth capabilities already in a device and the supplier’s product strategy. We do expect some product types will be upgradeable, but do not have visibility into specific product strategies. For certain Auracast™ transmitter categories such as TVs, we expect many will require a hardware upgrade. However, we also expect to see plug-and-play aftermarket Auracast™ transmitters used to add support for Auracast™ broadcast audio to TVs and other Auracast™ transmitter product types.”

Along the same lines, is it certain an HA that supports the V5 specification (I believe the Oticon Real 1 supports this level) will be upgradeable to the V5.2 specification required for Auracast?

Lastly, is Auracast implementation in public venues likely to be so far out that future-proofing hearing aids now shouldn’t be a concern for someone who normally upgrades every 5 years for financial reasons?

Am curious how other people purchasing hearing aids now are approaching this decision.

Thanks all, Drew

#2

I think it highly unlikely that Phonak Lumity support Auracast in the future as they are using Classic Bluetooth and I believe are using BT 4.2.

I think ANY currently sold hearing aid supporting Auracast in the future is a crapshoot. I think Resound Omnia has the best chance, but it is by no means guaranteed.

“Future proofing” tech is a fools game. If you’re convinced you’re going to want it as soon as it’s available, and you don’t have money to throw around, I’d suggest holding on to your current aids or getting lower cost aids in the interim (Costco or ??)

Hard to guess when Auracast will be widely available. I’d guess about 2-3 years, but it’s just a guess.

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#3

Thanks, I did find this fairly recent article about Auracast adoption:

Most of the current development seems to be coming out of Taiwan and I’ve seen these devices on Amazon. There was also a post the other day about Auracast being used in a new system for small groups to hear in noisy environments.

I guess mainstream consumer development probably is 1-3 years away and hearing aids after that. As you say, probably best not to take a “future-proof” strategy for buying hearing aids, at least not for at least another generation of HAs.

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#4

That’s one hell of an answer for something that was close to being a simple yes or no question.

#5

I thought it was a good answer.

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#6

I guess it’s remotely possible that some manufacturer has it almost ready to go. Why release it now when there’s no source device available for the aids to connect to? You’re just opening up a can of worms in the support department if you do. Once we’ve got a Samsung phone that unambiguously supports LE Audio AND buds from a major manufacturer that that phone can stream to, then it’s game on. People see it in action in the consumer audio space and ask if their hearing aids can do the same thing.

I find it hard to believe that hearing aids that have been released in the last six months don’t have the hardware required. I mean, would any of the people who sell Bluetooth ip to hearing aid makers have anything in their inventory now that wasn’t at least BT 5.2? BT 5.2 was released well over 3 years ago.

I would take a lot of convincing to pay full price for a set of premium aids that weren’t upgradeable to LE Audio. I’m dug in and waiting.

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#7

Hi @d_Wooluf, is there a LE Audio device (Auracast) that acts like Connect clip or Phonak Pen or Select. If this device could send the signal to the iPhone then to the HA’s, then it would be wonderful. This Auracast devices are very useful in noisy environment for those who are severe to profound hearing loss.
Now the MFI system is reasonable fine for 1) Live listen, 2) phone calls 3)music streaming 4) zoom meeting or online meeting.

#8

Hi @d_Wooluf ,
This might be the future:-

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#9

This is a wonderful assisted hearing device. @kevels55 @Volusiano @mdboy

#10

Very interesting. But the connection is only possible with hearing aids equipped with BLE, right?
And currently no HA has BLE, right?

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#11

It’s for buds as well and there are one or two models of le audio equipped buds available now. I don’t think Orsana is available now anyway. It seems to be a reference design that they’re looking for partners to develop.

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#12

I don’t think so. There’s a transmitter/receiver product (Voce), there’s a Sennheiser assistive system for watching tv, and there’s one- maybe two- models of earbuds. That’s all that I know of. If I understand you correctly, you probably want your phone to be able to act as a LE Audio “sink”- something that a source could stream to. I think that would be very useful but I don’t know if it would ever happen.

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#13

I agree. There’s already a topic on this.

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#14

I attach an excerpt from Bluetooth SIG (special interest group)
frequently asked questions section. Auracast - FAQ | Bluetooth® Technology Website

Question “What version of Bluetooth® technology is required to implement Auracast™ broadcast audio?”

Answer “Technically, for any product to support Auracast™ broadcast audio it must support specific features that were introduced in version 5.2 of the Bluetooth Core Specification as well as the Public Broadcast Profile within the set of LE Audio specifications.”

I don’t know whether the specification that applies is hardware or can be achieved by a firmware upgrade. But I suspect that it is not something that can be achieved by a software upgrade.

Regards

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#15

I have been off the board for several months now. I recently upgraded phones to a Pixel 7 pro. I did this because it has the hardware to support Auracast and LC3. I am hoping a new HA will come out soon which will support this new standard (BLE) and that there will be a new Hearing Aid that works with it as well. I hope there will be an upgrade to my pixel phone as well.

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#16

I wonder if someone with experience in both can chime in to share their opinion about how well the Auracast works compared to the Phonak Roger Mic? Also maybe on the technical differences and compatibility differences between them? It seems like the Roger Mic is exclusively for the Phonak platform? While the Auracast can become more universal when more hearing aids support BLE or maybe LC3???

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#17

Although Roger Mics works seamlessly with the latest Phonak aids, they can also be used with receivers that attach to the bottom of BTE aids. Receiver can also be used with Resound MultiMic and Oticon EduMic. Auracast offers the promise of universal compatibility but tough to compare to Roger as Auracast is currently essentially vaporware.
Edit: Roger Mics can also be used with any aid with a t-coil if an additional neck loop device is purchased.

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#18

Thanks for your kind comments. Yes, you are right. There is no HA’s that can connect to the Auracast protocol. I thought MFI HA’s are able to connect directly to Auracast protocol. Hope fully it will be very soon.
Have a nice day.

#19

Auracast is a Bluetooth spec. Roger is a device, so not directly comparable. What Auracast does do is enable devices like the Orsana.

AudioTelligence make claims about the performance of their advice compared to that of “existing assistive listening devices” (what else could it be except Roger?). Hunt around on YouTube if you’re interested. You’ll find demonstrations of its noise reduction.
If the demos are representative of real world performance, they’re pretty amazing.

(5 ways to help people hear better in noisy environments - AudioTelligence)

aiso™ for Hearing can improve the SRT by 16 dB, and at an SNR of minus -5 dB, a typical hearing aid would improve intelligibility by around 50%. One of the existing assistive listening devices would would improve it by around 80%, but aiso™ for Hearing can actually improve speech intelligibility by up to 98%. All of these figures are results from testing the devices not in a lab, but in a real world situation.

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#20

Thanks for the clarification and link references for me to peruse, @d_Wooluf ! I understand much better now! I saw the links for the AudioTelligence Orsana but couldn’t connect it to Auracast until now. Admittedly I was a little lazy and didn’t want to invest the time to learn the details beyond what’s on this thread yet, hence the dumb question.

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