Starting trial of Resound Linx 3D after Oticon OPN 1

I trailed the OPN 1s for a week before switching to the Linx 3D today. I will give it the full week, but I could tell within a few seconds that I didn’t like the 3Ds as much as the OPN 1s. The sound is duller overall. My wife declared she doesn’t like the 3Ds within 15 minutes of me arriving home tonight. Obviously I wasn’t hearing her as well.

The iPhone app, however, is superior to the Oticon app. The ability to manually adjust Bass, Middle, and Treble is very nice, and I like the Speech Clarity filter option. I haven’t tried the restaurant mode yet. I was at a reception earlier this evening in a large atrium (carpeted), and I could hear the speakers ok when I increased the volume and turned the Speech Filter on. I don’t feel like I’d have had to make the same adjustments with the OPN 1s, but I could be wrong.

Finally, whereas the sound from the iPhone wasn’t great with the OPN 1s, I feel like the 3Ds is worse. I’ll see how I adapt over the coming week. These are my first A-B comparison thoughts. For the record, I have no bias towards Oticon. If anything, I was slightly biased towards the Resound aids because of my interest in the multi-mic accessory. I’ll see how things go in meetings at work starting tomorrow.

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Don’t forget that the fittings are quite possibly using different rationales and settings; it’s really hard to say whether any differences you hear are intrinsic to the HA’s or are simply reflecting different programming. Having said that, I’ve tried both and prefer the OPN1’s, though I agree that the Resound app is far superior.

Thanks for sharing your impressions, ChrisM, on your different trials.

One thing I’d like to mention is that I’ve heard similar comments about how folks think that the Oticon ON app is lacking compared to other iPhone apps from Widex and Resound, etc. My personal opinion is that “less is more” actually. My view is not that the ON app is less robust or has less bells and whistles, it’s just that there simply isn’t much need for adjustment for the OPN for different environments, so a simple volume change and (up to 4) program selection is really all that’s needed. Sure it’s cool to see a dozen different program in the app for all kinds of listening environment that you can pick and choose from, but if the default program in the OPN can already handle virtually all listening environments automatically anyway, why need 20 different programs to choose from on the app?

I don’t see the value in adjusting middle or treble because the hearing aid is already supposed to be adjusted to compensate for the loss in your profile, so why would I want to change the mid and treble again? As for the bass, sure, if I can get more bass for music, it’s always nice. Everyone likes more bass to make the music feel more alive anyway. But since hearing aids can’t deliver much bass in the first place in the very low end, I don’t care to change the bass volume in the 250Hz and up. The bass I want to hear more is below that and it’s not possible to get it with the HA receiver.

I do have the ON app installed on my phone but I actually never have to touch it to adjust anything. I find reaching up to the hard buttons on the OPN to change programs or volume is much faster and easier than pick up the phone, wake it up, go to the ON app, just to change a program or a volume. So I prefer not having to use a phone app to control my OPN very often at all and I’m able to avoid doing it. I’m sure the ON app doesn’t do much not because Oticon engineers don’t know how to make it better. It’s because Oticon engineers don’t need to do much with it in the first place. That’s the beauty of “less is more”.

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Generally I agree that less is more. And yes, the OPN default program did feel like it was more robust than the Linx 3D default program thus far. One feature I like better on the ON app is the volume approach. Default is set to 0 level, and adjustments are +/- from there. That way I don’t have to remember that 8 is the default volume setting like I do on the Smart 3D app (yes, there appears to be the smallest of dots in the volume line indicator showing the default, but I had to look really close to notice it).

I’ve also noticed a time or two tonight when one of the Linx 3D aids dropped out briefly. I was able to pull up the app right when it happened and suddenly the volume indicators for the two aids didn’t match, despite the fact that I had previously set it to a single volume control for both. It quickly corrected itself before my eyes. Odd bug.

Forgive me for not recalling, @Volusiano, but do you use the Oticon TV streamer? I plan to buy one with whatever pair I buy because I loved it with my last pair. The independent volume control from the TV is great, especially since my wife has very sensitive hearing. Here preferred TV volume level is nearly inaudible to me without the streamer or turning the aids volume way up.

Yes, I like the 0 +/- approach on the ON app, too. Even without the app, when you move up or down on volume and get back to the default level again, you get and audible quick 3-beep to remind you that you’re back at the default level. I like that very much. You also hear a 3-beep when you hit the max or the min volume, which is nice. I have 4 clicks up from default before I hit the max, and 8 clicks down before I hit the min. That tells me how much headroom I have left on the volume scale, which is nice to know. On the iPhone it’s at 64% on the sliding scale (not the ON app, but the iPhone Hearing Devices settting).

I do have the Oticon TV streamer. The independent volume control is nice, but what’s nicer is that you can also control the OPN mic’s volume separately as well on the iPhone setting (not the ON app but the iPhone Hearing Device settings which you can quickly open by 3 quick clicks on the Home button). So for example if you’re at home watching TV but you want to hear your wife saying something, then turn on the mic volume to normal level. If you’re watching TV and a nearby noisy appliance is running or with noisy things going on, just turn the mic volume off and you will only hear the TV and nothing else.

One thing to bear in mind is that each brand has a different philosophy for processing the sound, microphone directionality and noise reduction. As an example, I’ve worn Phonak products for many years. Their products do an incredible job with environmental sounds. When you walk through the woods you will hear the leaves moving in the wind, birds chirping, etc. For some, this can be extremely overwhelming/annoying but for others, this is welcome. On the other hand, Phonak tends is weaker with music compared to the other brands. I’ve found Resound products to be much more accurate, better with phone integration and superior with music. Speech is low to medium noise environments is excellent. In additional to these points, each person’s hearing loss profile and daily lifestyle will also factor into which brand’s method of processing works best.

Trick is to test many brands. Make sure your audiologist does a Real Ear Measurement (REM) before starting adjustments and…don’t make a decision until you have had lots of time to evaluate the performance, provide feedback to your audiologist and had the hearing aids adjusted 3-5 times to fine tune.

Jordan

Great points, @JordanK. I always give myself time to adjust to new aids because they’re all qualitatively different in their sound experience. Your example of various noises in the background is apt. I noticed that typing on my keyboard and other similar noises were quite pronounced with the OPN 1s but less so with the Linx 3Ds. I can see why some people like the latter because it seems to dampen a lot of background noises while making voices more salient. I tend to like the fuller, more inclusive sound experience, though. I’m the same way with lighting–I like clean-room level lighting :smile:

I’m starting mine next week! Keep us updated!! I hated OPN 1…just not loud enough for me.

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What is that?
My audi does an audiogram and smth where they need be to recognize words…

|The way “testing” work in my country is this:
You pay full cost. You test it a week, if you like it it’s yours, if not you send it back and get your money back - a fee [ about 150$ or more ].

Very expensive to “test many brands”.

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Hi…chiming in here for the first time in a long time. I have been using the ReSound Linx2 which is pretty similar to the 3D. I haven’t tried the Oticon. But I just need to say, I fully use all features of the ReSound Smart App. I am a musician and have many favorites settings for various reasons. I find the Smart app could be much more feature-rich (e.g, how about a 5 band EQ?) so cannot imagine having even less options.

I know I have had the same experience of initially not liking a pair of aids and having my friends tell me I am not doing as well. It takes at least a week, perhaps more for me to get in the groove with a new set. And that also means at least a few more visits to the audiologist to tweak.

Please keep us informed though, very interested!

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Yes, this is an improvement over what my last TV streamer program was, which was shut off all mics in favor of the streamer’s feed. It’s too bad that streamers and other accessories are not included in trials (at least in my experience).

The Linx 3D streaming sound (from my iPhone) is a bit “tinny” to me. Turning up the bass was helpful, but I liked the OPN 1 better in that regard.

Approaching 24 hours with the Linx 3Ds, I’m appreciating the hearing experience approach a bit more. I can really see why some people find them favorable to the OPN 1s. They don’t let the same level of background/ambient noise.

This is a fundamental difference between the OPN and most other hearing aids that you’re experiencing. The OPN follows a new and different paradigm called “open”, and the whole philosophy behind it is that it wants you to hear everything, even what you consider noise. But it will still do very effective noise management to give speech clarity, but it’s just that it won’t block out noise because sometimes what’s considered noise can become desirable to hear at the next moment’s notice. Also in the case of multiple speech sources, its philosophy is that it’s more helpful to present multiple speech sources to the brain so that it has more information to know how to differentiate and know what to focus on and what to tune out, than to block out and present a single speech source that’s still tainted with noise which may not be as easily separated by the brain.

So it really boils down to the user’s preference on how they want to hear. Some people who can’t or don’t want to handle too many sound sources can find the OPN overwhelming and may never adjust. Those people like the noise blocking approach better. Others are fine with multiple noise sources (and may even prefer so) as long as they can still hear and understand the desired speech source just fine.

The Linx3D has a program called “Outdoors” which basically puts the microphones full wide open to give you that big environmental sound experience while walking around outdoors in the woods, etc. Nice option if you don’t always like the big sound feeling that Oticon and Phonak typically provide by default in the automatic mode. I haven’t tried the OPNs but all my Phonak hearing aids had that big sound feeling. Works well in the woods but walk around in a busy shopping mall or an airport and it wears you out. Too much sound.

Jordan

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Please help me to understad a thing.

Notice that I did’t buy new HA for 8 years and was wearing Widex M4-9 before.

At the time I’m trying the LINX2 9 I do not feel comfort because of adaptive automatic system. It always do sounds louder or quiter and you can not control them. It always jumps from side to side when you change your enviroment and makes me mad. Do you feel the same with OPN or LINX 3D?

And one more question: if you do not use the new auto systems in top rated HAs are they worth to buy them? As I understand the most exclusive technology and the reason why you wanna buy this kind of HAs is that system. And there is nothing better here if you off all systems.

I am a new member here so I am really sorry if I do something wrong.

I can try to answer for the OPN only as an owner wearing the OPN, and somebody else can help answer for the LINX 3D who wears it.

While the OPN can hold up to 4 programs, it does not have an automatic adaptive system that automatically detects the listening environment and changes from one program to another depending on the listening environment. It always stays in one program only until you manually switch to another program.

HOWEVER, this is not to say that the OPN doesn’t have the capability to detect a listening environment. But the way the OPN defines a listening environment is different than other HA brands. For example, the listening environment for a non-OPN brand may be associated with the program, like “quiet” mode, “car” mode, “restaurant mode”, “music mode”, “outdoors mode”, “windy mode”, etc. and the listening environment is detected to activate the switching to the appropriate program/mode.

But for the OPN, the listening environment is not associated with program/mode. It’s simply defined as “simple” listening environment on one end, and “complex” listening environment on the other end. Simple environments here defined as low or medium level, with low reverberation effects, and few disturbing sound sources. Usually, there is a high SNR (signal to noise ratio) making it easy to hear target speech. If there are multiple sound sources, they are spatially separated making them easy to tell apart from each other. An example of a simple listening environment could be a living room where the television is on at a low level and there are two talkers, besides the hearing aid wearer, who are sitting on either side of the person.

Complex listening environments are here defined as environments with a low SNR or a fluctuating SNR, and high sound levels. Multiple sound sources are present and are difficult to separate spatially. Reverberation and wind noise may be present and there may be noise sources that make it difficult to hear and understand target speech. An example of a complex listening environment can be a conversation between four people at an outdoor café on a busy street.

Based on the personalization of the wearer’s preference inputs at the start of the programming, a “help” profile is created for that wearer. It can be Low, Medium or High. This “help” profile in turn sets the control inputs on the Balance module and Noise Removal module to vary depending on the Listening environment. Below is an example of how the control is set for the Noise Removal module based on the Listening Environment across the Help profile:

In each of the 4 OPN programs (there can be up to 4 but usually only the default one is enough), the Help profile and the noise reduction level for Simple and Complex listening environment can be set/adjusted.

For the OPN, the transitions between simple environments and complex environments as explained above are not points on a line, but rather, they are continuous and smooth. The OSN aka OpenSound Navigator (the OPN core processing engine) cannot be described in terms of modes that the system switches between because in effect there are an infinite number of possible configurations of the system. In turn, this means that OSN does not have a mode switch with the potential audible artifacts that mode switches are known to cause.

So by default you don’t control the transition between listening environments in the OPN, and it’s dynamically activated all the times. The OSN cycles through its processing 500 times per second and it’s all automatic. That’s why there’s really no need to have multiple programs for the OPN. One default program is good enough to manage all listening environments because each program encompasses all listening environments inside that single program already, in contrast to the other HA brands where each program is associated with one distinct listening environment that needs to be detected and switched back and forth / to and from.

I primarily just use the one default OPN program for 95% of the time because it can manage all of my listening environments in that one program already. I only use the other OPN programs to control other static settings, like have my default program 1 with Speech Rescue enabled, program 2 WITHOUT Speech Rescue. Program 3 has Speech Rescue with the volume of the frequency-lowered sounds set to maximum. Program 4 is set to the built-in Music mode where all noise reduction is disabled. But bear in mind that ALL listening environments are managed within every single one of those 4 programs already. So I can stay in any one of those 4 programs all day long and it would still serve me just fine as I move in and out of various listening environments that day.

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Don’t worry about asking questions. That’s what this forum is for. To help answer questions.

In my opinion, the automatic mode is where all the technology investment goes for each hearing aid brand. This is where each company uses their software to simulate a normal ear experience for a deaf person and this is where each brand is different. This is also why you have to try different brands to see whose automatic mode works best for you. The other thing to remember is that a good audiologist can go into the automatic mode and adjust the programming for each of the automatic programs if you are having issues. This is why I am so insistent on finding a skilled audiologist who knows the software first and then testing hearing aids that the audiologist knows how to adjust. So if you find the hearing aids suddenly get louder and it doesn’t help you, the audiologist can fix this problem.

Jordan

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Hi:

First of all, Thank you very much to all the people writing opinions in this thread.

I have a Siemens Pure 701 119/55 HAs. I am having problems with them and I am looking for a substitute.

I am 51 years old. I teach Computer Science in a Spanish University. Also I am very fond of music.

I think OPN 1 and LINX 3D are my main candidates to buy. Must I buy yet? Or must I wait for the second gen of these hearing aids?

jpeinado

Well, the Linx are on their 3rd iteration on that hardware platform. They have changed a lot since the 1st ones. Its MFi interface is solid and has been from the start. They added quite a bit in directionality and noise control which has been he major thrust of all of them.

The OPN is a different concept depending on the brain to control more. The objective is more open sounds from a variety of sources. They are MFi but haven’t been able to serve Android phones. The accessory needed has gone through a series of delays without an end in site. The alternative is Bernafon that uses the same hardware but more traditional software. They are well thought of for music.

As I remember, you’ve had the Signia for not that long. Depending on trials in your country, you might try them if you are still having classroom problems.

Resound App works on Android. Though you’ll need a mic to stream