Thanks much. I am turning my Omnia 9 back tomorrow and trying Starkey’s newest. Omnia was problematic from the start. Connecting to my iPhone 12 initially took 3 attempts. With my hearing recruitment I was not happy with the Marie receiver so changed to the Resound standard receiver. Initially would not connect with the native PC software. The audiologist spent 20 minutes on the phone with Resound and we connected but after hang up we lost the connection and we’re never able to complete the programming. An upgrade to IOS blew out partial support for the Apple Watch which has still not been fixed. Lumity was not available at the time so I will be trying Starkey Evolve AI. Hoping for success.
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Wow, the firmware is so buggy, ugh WTF, resound, you think they would release something that wasn’t buggy. This is the first time I have a buggy brand new hearing aid in my 30 years of wearing them…
Hey Jordan. Activent receivers would be pointless and expensive for you. They are designed for people who have normal or mild hearing loss in the low frequencies, and would therefore be fit with an open dome. If your activent opened up, you’d lose all the low-end amplification that you require. Activents need to be changed every 6 months and they are $$$.
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Thanks for that advice, Louie. Since I have decent low-frequency hearing and have been wearing occlusive molds to keep out noise and boost bass when streaming, I had idly been wondering if I’d want to get Activent receivers if I decided to go with Phonak for my next set of HA’s. Your comment convinced me that I should stick with occlusive molds (~1 mm vent). I don’t fancy buying a new set of Activents ~every six months! ($$$).
I like such molds because I think they also help improve the clarity of my speech understanding a bit, too, as well as addressing the previous issues I mentioned. My main hang-up is that I’ve wondered if I’m increasing the chances of an ear infection by helping to keep the humidity within my ear canals very high. Thanks for any advice you might have about that concern and if it’s a real risk, the best ways of minimizing such a risk.
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It’s certainly plausible that a fully occluded mould would increase the risk of infection. Do your moulds have a vent? Looking at your audiogram, I’d recommend at least a 2mm vent. There’s no way you should be fully occluded. If you are, perhaps the regular use of some dry-ear spray to evaporate any moisture in the ear could minimise the risk of infection??
Thanks for the suggestion about a dry-ear spray. A review article posted by MDB in 2017 led me to read a 2006 Widex white paper on venting and its pros and cons. I agree with the 2006 Widex paper that for the “naturalness” of hearing with a vent, you can lose a bunch of speech clarity, depending on the acoustics of your ear canal, the timing of your HA’s in processing, etc. I do a lot of noisy stuff, so I particularly like keeping the noise out. That’s why Phonak invented Activents in the first place. There are certain situations where open venting just doesn’t cut it. According to Phonak, that’s places like noisy restaurants and when streaming, where you might not want the streamed bass escaping your ear canals (what goes in easily can come out easily, too!).
Thread started by MDB in 2017 (it’s on a review paper): Article on open fit vs closed fit
2006 Widex white paper on venting mentioned in review cited by MDB: Article on open fit vs closed fit - #12 by jim_lewis
Widex pulled its original posting of the white paper, perhaps because the paper was from 16 years ago or maybe something to do with Widex’s acquisition by WS Audiology. So, there are several posts by me in the same thread trying to find a viable link for other forum members to download the paper in its original form to read.
Edit_Update: Actually, the Widex Pro site now has an archive of older “evidence” papers that go all the way back to 2000 or so.https://www.widexpro.com/en/business-support/evidence/#archive Many of the papers include Kuk as the lead author, as he was for the 2006 white paper. So, for whatever reasons, Kuk’s 2006 paper has been tossed from the Widex Pro archives but it’s hearingreview.com version is still available to read (https://hearingreview.com/practice-building/practice-management/fitting-tips-how-do-vents-affect-hearing-aid-performance).
Here’s a 2005 paper by Kuk, still in the Widex Pro archives and available to read on the web at hearingreview.com without having to download a PDF that reaches similar conclusions as the 2006 paper, which was more in detail. From the 2nd paragraph of the concluding Discussion:
The current study results were obtained with an ear-set that offers minimal occlusion of the ear canal. The advantage is clearly seen in the elimination of the occlusion effect. The disadvantage, however, is seen in the magnitude of the SNR improvement offered by the adaptive directional microphone. In this study, an average improvement of 1.8 dB SNR was observed between the adaptive directional microphone and the omnidirectional microphone. The same adaptive directional microphone, when evaluated in other studies where the vent diameter was typically less than 2.0-2.5 mm, showed a directional benefit that varied from 4 dB12 to 4-6 dB.13 In another study19 where the Diva adaptive directional microphone was fit on individuals with a more severe hearing loss (and consequently no venting was used), an even higher directional benefit of 6-8 dB was reported.
Efficacy of an Open-Fitting Hearing Aid | The Hearing Review
Thank you for your report Jordan–It is the only way we can actually know about these new devices or upgrades. Please keep it up. Sadly, in some cases, like mine–the only way to find out about them is by buying them and using them. We have no option to do a comparison before purchasing.
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My pleasure! It’s my way of giving back to the community and helping others who struggle (like me) with hearing loss.
As of today, here is my update: Phonak Lumity is quite superb and feels like it is much more sophisticated in adapting to, music, noise and many other complex hearing environments. Resound Omnia is good but doesn’t feel like a major step forward (compared to Quattro) other than the addition of their own version of StereoZoom.
I might try having the audiologist refit Omnia with a different first fit algorithm and see how that goes.
Jordan
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I completely agree , I used to have the resound quattro before getting the omnia, sound the same but mic is more sensitive but buggier than the Quattro… I can’t use the binaural beamformer because of my unique hearing configuration…
Yeah definitely, it’s extremely rare for there to be a “wow” factor when these new platforms are released for most people, ReSound claimed a 150 % increase in what… There’s no enjoyment when i read posts from people who say, i have Marvel/ Paradise and “can’t wait” to get the new Lumity( or what ever other brand) the manufacturer’s are pretty good with the “blurb” and marketing hype, but real world experience is offen quite different.
I, too, am disappointed that the Charger Case Ease for the Lumity doesn’t have a battery for on-the-go charging. I purchased the optional power pack for my Phonak Marvel charger case and was hoping a power pack would be available for the Lumity’s Charger Case Ease.
" Maybe Resound designed the hearing aids like this by choice to accommodate OLDER USERS who don’t like all the environmental clatter "
I TAKE UMBRAGE ! Ha Ha Ha…
great post Jordan please keep them coming. I recently trialed More and like my Opn I find them difficult in noise likley due to the severity of my loss. Next week I trial Lumity and after that who knows maybe Omni.
Thanks,
Tony
No worries. I didn’t mean to offend our elderly members on this forum…haha. My appologies.
I will keep posting my updates and thank you for the kind words. I will say that some people prefer to hear everything and other people find all the environmental sounds to be irritating. Hearing aid users tend to have a much higher percentage of elderly users so kinda makes sense they would provide an initial fit for this segment of the population. I would also say new users might find all the clatter to be irritating too.
Please post your feedback on Lumity. I strongly believe I am hearing way more with these Lumity hearing aids but I want others who are trying them out to confirm this. I need a sanity check before I buy them. I can’t quite say for certain what the hearing aids are doing exactly. My gut tells me a few things are happening:
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Lumity seems to be doing something to the clarity of speech. I read they added a few features in AutoSense 5.0 which enhances soft consonants and this might be why I am experiencing better clarity. The reason I mention this is that when I flip over to Omnia, I lose this and people’s voices seem less clear and a little muddled. The voices in Omnia are loud but not as clear. I would love for someone to verify this.
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Second thing I have noticed is that Lumity is really good at detecting speech from different directions and then focusing in on that speech. It does this really quickly so it feels very natural. Net effect is that you end up hearing conversations from the side and from behind really well. I have tested this out in a few different situations and it works really well. Would love someone to confirm this too. Omnia is supposed to have this but it doesn’t seem to work the same way.
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Last thing is the noise reduction. It’s very fast and very smooth. I actually just noticed it now. I was walking with my wife outside. A gust of wind hit my face and her voice changed slightly as the wind blocking feature kicked in and the environment went a bit dead. It was so fast I didn’t even hear the wind. I just felt it. As we turned the corner, the wind was blocked by houses and this wind block feature immediately dropped off and my wife’s voice (and the environment) quickly returned to normal. The whole process was very fast and the transition was very smooth. Same thing happens when you walk into a very noisy place. I will say Omnia was similar in this regard.
Please let me know if you are testing Lumity and you have noticed any of these things.
Jordan
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Well I am almost 75 and wear Oticon More1 aids as my primary and Oticon OPNS1 as my backups. At this time I have my More1 aids sent off to Oticon for a checkup. I live in a forest and walk the trails and love having my surround sound. I have been wearing Oticon aids for over 12 years and have tried different brands of aids a long my 18 + years of wearing aids. The main thing I dislike about some brands is the feeling I have hearing blinders on. I know I don’t and can’t hear every sound around me but I want to hear everything I can. Over the years some sounds starting out irritating but my brain adapted to the sounds.
I ride my Vespa with a helmet and my aids on and have no issues. I love being able to have the windows down when I am driving or riding in the Jeep, I guess it is all about getting use to things.
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Did they complete real-ear measures? If yes, can’t you just have them match the gain output of the two hearing aids?
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I think it’s quite possible that Phonak does make the best hearing aids. I would think the best reviews would come from audiologists who have the equipment, the knowledge, and a variety of patients to test the performance of various hearing aids on. The best subjects to test on, though, might be normal hearing folks, as they can tell what all the sounds sound like to their unaided ears vs., say, solely through their HA’s with occlusive molds.
One problem that I find with reviewers like Dr. Cliff and Matthew Allsop (now the official Hearing Tracker YouTuber) is that they pull their punches. They rarely make direct comparisons between different brand aids. Perhaps because they don’t want to offend and lose followers who are enthusiastic about a particular brand that they would not rate as the very best or perhaps they don’t want to sour OEM connections from which they get equipment to test and do their YouTube shows, etc.
Dr. Cliff has serious hearing problems in one ear, but Matthew Allsop says that he has normal hearing. So possibly in his reviews, he could speak directly to what reproducible sound sounds like unaided vs. listened through the HA’s with the HA electronics set entirely to reproduce all the sound he hears in quiet vs. noisy situations.
Another concern of reviews is related to, “Do we all see the same color red?” And perhaps extending from that, do we prefer Beats audio to regular music? Or when we take digital photos, do we think the prettiest pictures have lots of saturation in them that really isn’t in the real-life scene. Almost every digital camera adds color saturation to a photo, and we like the effect - so that’s why it’s typically done. Is there that sort of thing going on in HA sound reproduction, too?
So in the absence of all of the above more diligent comparisons and knowing exactly what’s going on with reproduced sound vs. sound heard directly by normal hearing ears, I’d say the best thing that we all have to go on is trial several hearing aids and see what works best for you. Because the color of red you like best may be different that a bunch of other people prefer.
But given the general enthusiasm on the forum for Phonak HA’s, I’d say it’s likely they are close to the very best, if not the absolute best in sound reproduction, and then you have to weigh in other factors that might matter to you, such as do you like MFi hearing devices, long rechargeable battery life, the ability to control your HA’s from a smartwatch rather than having to grab your phone, etc.
I’d say for ReSound that the financial considerations that MDB has brought to light might be a bit of a worry down the line, too. Apple and the MFi OEMs really need to come up with a very good reason to prefer that sort of functionality over all Phonak has to offer in the classic BT arena. It looks like BT LE Audio currently is not going to be the cavalry riding over the hill any time soon to rescue MFi OEMs who’ve gone to the trouble of implementing BT 5.3 in their HA’s. But time will tell.
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Well I am a believer in that only the person with the hearing loss can say what is the best hearing aids for that person’s needs. So all of the hearing aid companies make the best aids for the people that prefer that companies aids. To my while I have friends that wear phonak aids and really like them, I personally don’t like the sound of the phonak aids. Way back in my early hearing aid days I really liked the Siemens hearing aids. I have tried the Resound aids also as my audiologist said I might like them and I didn’t like the overall sound. And my audiologist had a hard time adjusting them to my difficult hearing loss.
I am sure with time and patience I could adapt to a different brand of aids but why should I as long as the company I like makes aids that fit my needs.
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Well I don’t agree with Phonak being the “best” especially when just using some of the reviews from people on this forum and online, so I’d like to ask what is the best make of vehicle, and which is the best mobile phone to get, so saying one is “best” is not something I’d like to try and describe, I’d more likely say, Phonak is one brand that has a solid foundation/reputation for their HAs…but so do others.
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I think tenkan is on track about why these audiologists don’t single out a particular hearing aid as “best”. At the end of the day, they are very similar. You can pick out particular features and say “XX has the best wind noise management” or “YY has the best accessories”, but no one is just slam-dunk “the best” all around. If that were the case, all clinicians would just be fitting that one device exclusively.
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