Phonak Marvel - vibrating tremolo effect for high pitched (electronic) sounds

It seems there’s no way with the current interface to enter one’s audiogram anymore. I’ve been through the whole account and preferences area but haven’t found anything. What I have found is that it looks like they changed it in mid 2018 or so, from some posts I was able to dig up.

Hey Jo58,
After the Widex Evoke 2-week trial I looked forward to testing the Phonak Audeo Marvel’s and also because Phonak does such great advertising campaign, LOL
3 days into my examination I too noticed a distorted effect above mid-high gain on certain sounds not unlike the tremolo you described, I told my Audi it should be called the Tambourine Effect.
I did not have the Tambourine Effect in my three other tryouts; Oticon OPN’s, Signia Stilletto’s and of course the Widex Evoke (which are the HA’s that I have just ordered)

I spent a good bit of time trying to find a way to make a change to my audiogram. I couldn’t find a way to do it. I certainly hope this gets fixed soon.

Try searching “Where do I post my audiogram”

2 Likes

Posting My Audiogram: I’ve been searching for this for hours over several days and I can’t find anything that works. I’ve found a half-dozen instructions, slightly different at times, possibly illustrating changes over the last year or two. They all seem to boil down to going to your HearingTracker (not Forum) profile, and you should see “Add My Audiogram” or a chart or something. My HearingTracker profile just has my avatar, my name, my bio blurb, and NOTHING else. Just some ads on the right. At the top, MyAccount is not a pull-down menu as pictured in some of the explanatory posts.

Is there something I’m missing? Am I not worthy because I’ve been signed up only a few days?

Finally found this. It worked for me.

This Link

2 Likes

I had searched. Until the link buried in a forum post to here was shared, I couldn’t find anything. There appear to be no direct links from anyplace you’d set up your profile. I’ve now added mine.

Great thread here! This is why I love this forum :blush:

Audiogram is coming back soon. In the meantime please use the link above to our old audiogram input. Sorry about the delay!

2 Likes

What the OP is describing is classic feedback cancellation trying to cancel something that isn’t feedback. It used to be called entertainment, don’t know if the term has changed.

Most of the big companies now have separate music algorithms that can be applied where the FB canceler is static rather than adaptive, and all the features that would try to self adjust or manipulate the signal are turned off.

3 Likes

The Rexton/Signia KS8 switches the Feedback control to slow from the default fast, for the music programs. It can also be turned off, but that may not be acceptable to those who are using a lot of gain.

I’ve ended my trial with the Marvels early. While the technician was able to give me a manual program for music, the trilling/tremolo effect in every day life - on louder higher pitched voices, on computer prompts, microwave beeps, etc - was, to me, unacceptable. In certain cases, it rendered speech unrecognizable.

Perhaps a different technician at Costco will have better luck dialing it in. I am glad I was able to document the issues with audio clips before turning them in. So, we will see what happens with KS-9s and/or the Philips HearingLink from Costco. My appointment there is for August 8th.

1 Like

I thought the KS9 was a Phonak Marvel? Don’t you think it will be the same?

Since it seems to be sporadic (from user to user), I am hoping a different technician may have other ideas. I wish they would give me access to the software. Pretty sure I could find a reasonable threshold for where and when the various tools that make up feedback rejection kick in. Anyway, I will see what happens.

1 Like

Can’t do that…

it is set within the algorithm. Not sure about Phonak, but some companies give the option to make it static (only look for feedback within a narrow frequency spectrum based on the canceler routine) or adaptive (it looks for feedback everywhere.)

In the little I saw of the Phonak software, there are at least four parameters in the “sound recover” section, with settings that run from 0 to 20. Most of the parameters were set at 8. I wish I’d paid more attention the first time I saw it. It’s how we figured out how to run the WhistleStop down to 0 for the music program. Hopefully, the Costco technician will allow me to see and work with me to get something that minimizes these distortions.

Better acoustic coupling will often trump software wrangling.

1 Like

Neville, This problem isn’t feedback. The problem is the aid recognizing higher pitched pure tones as feedback and then hopping into anti-feedback mode. Coupling will not make a difference. Have you listened to the audio samples I provided a few posts above? They illustrate the problem.

And great samples they are too, illustrating my own problem also.
I had been trying to tune my Phonak Nathos Autos. I asked the advice of another forum member here by private message how they eliminated their vibrato situation and using DSL v5a was apparently the answer.
I thought I had already tried all the Fitting Formulas and had decided upon Adaptive Phonak Digital Contrast being the best sounding - save for the vibrato. So I tried DSL v5a and it did indeed reduce the vibrato but not totally eliminate it. So I went through all the Fitting Formulas again and found that NAL-NL 2 Tonal was even better. I still had vibrato sometimes but less often than I had previously.

Two days ago, I tried some Oticon Dynamo SP8s and the audiologist said that he’d been advised to use the NAL-RP fitting formula (Rationale in the Genie software) to match my previous use comfort and the result was brilliant! Sadly, that formula, whatever it is, is not available in the Phonak Target software but I found it strange that it was similar (sounding at least) to what I found the best for the Phonaks.

1 Like

Actually I’m thinking you would need to record using a proper hearing aid analyser, with hearing aids fitted to your ears ( just like when your audiologist does REM) to get accurate results as to what the hearing aids are getting through the mic’s and reproducing through the receivers, as sound is reproduced differently from when fitted to your ears and being in an open room. Did you try replacing the receiver in case something is going on there, another way to reduce this affect is if you use standard receivers for your loss and then fit medium power receivers, maybe try again like this to see if you have the same effect. Hearing aids are made for human speech (vowel, consonants) and not music after all.
Listening to your recordings it just seems so peculiar.

That’s a fair point but I’m sure the sounds are fairly similar if my own sounds are anything to go by. I’m sure uburoibob’s point is to give an indication of what is happening with the aids, not to reproduce an accurate representation.

That’s not true, not these days with digital aids and Music programs available.

1 Like