New to Oticon Spirit 3/Synchro HAs and struggling

I’ve had a sensorineural hearing loss in both ears since I was little. It’s a cookie bite loss which means I miss the middle frequencies quite a bit. Over the years I have adapted with lip reading and so on. But I’m aware I don’t hear too well and as a lecturer that’s no good.

In the UK I have been fitted with Oticon Spirit 3 (Synchro) digital HAs with open dome tips and thin tubes. (I tried the moulds but they cut me off from the world entirely.) Apart from making everything sound a bit tinny and making sounds a bit louder, I have not really noticed any greater clarity, which is what I am after.

The television still has to be at the same loud volume. If people laugh it hurts. I think what I am getting is a boost in the high frequencies which I do not need a lot of. I don’t need any bass boost.

Is it possible for these HAs to be tuned to boost the mid-frequencies without boosting highs and lows? I had thought it was meant to be their advantage. Also are there any softer tips for the ears? The ones I have are quite soft but they make my ears sore after an hour or less.

I’m at the point where I don’t think it’s worth continuing with these. However, I don’t know if it is me, the particular HA, the HA settings, or what.

I would appreciate any feedback, advice, comments, etc.

thanks, John

John:

I had been fitting Oticon for the longest time… I can tell you a personal secret… I while a go I started to fit sincro and tegos and notice that
most of my clients where real happy when I fit the tegos…

So i had a few clients, which wore sincros try the tego’s almost all of them
prefer the tego… So as an advice… Ask your audi to test you with tego or tego pro…


Uggs

Hi Xbulder and thank you for the advice. That was the kind of inside information I was looking for. I know you are a key person in this forum, so I appreciate the comment. I’m due to to visit my audiologist on Jan 2, so I shall suggest this.

I already begin to feel better.

Happy new year,

John

by the way, as you know Genie (the fitting program)
has something call adaptation manager ( GN has the same in the Azure call acceptance manager),

because generally gain is overwellming, the acceptance manager provides less gain so that you first get use to having the aids on and gradually the gain is increase to provide the entire compensation (as prescribed)

Sincro had something where it was automatically done, i generally prefer it manually. If the cost is not so different- get an epoq…

I had meet quite a few customers which said that the sincro is a tyring instrument… that by the time it is 6-7 in the afternoon they simply can not be bear…

I have heard people saying that the epoq is considerable more gentle…
this was one of the few surprises of me … Given that the instrument
does not really prescribe a lot compression…

I have heard a lot of people using Widex - specially the senso in the earlier days, saying the instrument was real confortable…

By the way…

ask him to check MEMORY (datalogging), try to have him see what sort
of enviroment you are facing so he can make appropiate changes…

have him use sound studio to fine tune the instrument (the sound library)…

Have him run soft, medium and loud sounds

and finally ask him to perform REM on you… (see our posts on what is rem)

Hi hotdog654321

My Audi was telling me about one of his clients that was particularly sensitive, so he completely removed the dome from the tube (open fit BTE), and the guy (an M.D.) is happy as a clam. Just a thought. Good luck.

Dag

I visited my audiologist yesterday, having printed out Xbulder’s helpful comments to guide me. Unfortunately every time I go to the hospital I see a different one. However, yesterday’s was a chief audiologist and I felt that she listened to me more than the other about my experiences.

As it stands under the UK health system, this is the HA that’s prescribed. Apparently it varies a little from the Syncro, but uses the same software. I mentioned that for me there was little clarity in the midrange where I need it. Indeed she decided to check my audiogram by testing me at the 750mz level which hadn’t been done. (Link to scanned audiogram here: http://www.johnflood.co.uk/summerschool/documents/Flood_audiogram_Jan2008.pdf)

The other thing the audi did was to change the tips from tulips/dome to elephant ears which are soft flaps. I will experiment with both.

She did a lot more adjusting than the first time around. We cut more of the high end and boosted the middle. She took the program up to level 3 for me, but cut the volume a bit. She also boosted the left ear high end because that 's not so good as the right ear.

She said she couldn’t do REM testing because they had been getting a high number of errors. Apparently some Australian group has been doing research in this area. The hospital hopes to get a new machine before long, then I’ll be tested.

She also told me how to clean them which the previous audi hadn’t done and gave me spare tips of both kinds.

She confirmed Xbulder’s idea of the epoq too. I will have to think about this.

In all I feel better after yesterday’s consultation than I did after the first, both mechanically and personally. I went in feeling frustrated and irritated and came out feeling happier. I have also requested that next time I go back I see this audi again. She was happy with that, despite the fact that I must seem an awkward bloke at times…

Now comes the interesting bit. I will be out of the UK until the end of May in Miami, so I can’t have any follow up testing until I return. So what I’ve got at the moment is what I must use. The next several months will be time of experiment and adjustment.

Thank you for all your help. John

if you do get the epoq get them rite with an micromold

you muight have serious recruitment… given this steep loss

defineteyl the epoq would do better, the true dynamics will make the aid

considerable confortable…

Another tip, could be to measure the UCL per frequency… this could change
}
th compresion parameters…

Xbldr you seem to have had a lot of experience fitting Tego Pro’s. I am into my first set of HA’s; (1-1/2 years) they are Tego Pro BTE’s with deep tight molds. They work well except for in such places as resturants where lots of people are chatting away. Then it is very difficult to understand speech. Do you know if the the Epoch’s work any better in such places? I am considering them also because they have blue tooth and wonder if they work well with my blue tooth cell phone.

there is a world of difference between the tego pro and the epoq,
audiologically speaking… SOme of the improvement over the tego are
datalogging, datalearning, true dynamics (similar to what GN has), tri state noise reduction… etc My suggestion have your audi program a couple and
walk out the office in a busy street… Most my clients which had syncros has upgraded them to epoq

Xbulder, you are right. I do have recruitment. In fact when I go to a concert now I wear baffles (like ear plugs but they let sound through) because some high notes and the applause of an audience can be painful.

John

it might be a good idea to measure the LDL in most of the frequencies,
remember the software measures the UCL based on data drawn from large sample sizes, therefore it is subject to errors… therefore getting the
LDL or the UCL levels per frequencies would ensure the aid is confortable
always…

A while ago, 7yrs ago- we used to have a tool (oticon aids) call the MCR which measures in situ the complete confortable range…

The result was a confortable fit… But it was my personal experience that most clients said they felt they did gave up some speech understanding…

their in lies the trade off…

Now it is no longer an option in most oticon products (except for Gaia- which is a very old product)… However, other manufactures do have something similar Widex sensogram and Phonak has something similar…

The reason why I have heard it was taken out is that it was subject to many mistakes… I disagree as a dispenser what it is important is to have the tools regardless of whether i use them or not…:smiley:

I keep learning new things! I googled LDL and got low density lipoprotein instead of loudness discomfort level. I begin to see what you say. In some ways sounds do seem loud to me, but I am unsure if that is what I ought to be hearing as opposed to merely being too loud. I am still only wearing my HAs for short periods of around an hour. However, when I googled UCL and finally got uncomfortable level of loudness, I became confused. I can’t really see a distinction between LDL and UCL. It seems there is more about UCL than LDL.

One other factor was that with the audi we sat in a “dead” room (there was carpet on the walls). Sounds are perceived–at least by me–differently there compared to a “live” room. My house, for example, has little in the way of soft furnishings and is therefore full of noises. The audi did at one point turn on a speaker with simulated party noise then spoke through it herself. But still in the same room.

Is it possible for an audi to set up HAs outside or in live surroundings? I imagine that might make things more difficult, but there is a big difference between the real world and an acoustically dampened one.

John

dear John:
ldl and UCL pretty much interchangable terms…

yes you are right… In one of the office when i worked i used to do a first fit
the instruments inside the office and walk out in the busy street. Outside we had set up a Special tray where we walk out and pull the tray and fine tune the clients… I had tons of clients which decided for highervalue aids when
they experience the performance in the “real world”

by the way, in this modern times most clinics have like a 7.1 speaker system in such a way that those conditions can be simulated with out
the added inconvinence…

Clients do love to walk outside and to experience how things sound in the real world… this can not be simulated…

Hello everybody,

Just got my first Oticon Spirit 3 BTE. Did the fitting yesterday, took around one hour, not many tests though, I guess is too early to make any judgments, as it’s my first hearing aid as well (unilateral mild hearing loss).

For the time being I would like to know more about this product so I am wondering where can I find full specifications / description / user manual for this. I have the feeling that this is a product designed for NHS, as I couldn’t find its specifications on Oticon site.

Cheers

Sometimes Oticon makes products for one specific client which buys in large volume, the spirit 3 is the same as the Oticon Syncro, which was the previous top of the line instrument…
look on oticon website
cheers

Hi

I practice in the UK as a Hearing Aid Audiologist. The Oticon Spirit that is produced for the National Health Service and provided free of charge is not a Syncro it is a Tego pro.

Hope this help…The Epoq is miles ahead

sorry I stand back corrected

yes the Epoq is miles ahead I stand corrected

is there like a spirid 1 and 2?

I can’t find the exact specifications to the Oticon Spirit 3, but you can download information on other Oticon HAs at http://www.oticon.co.uk/uk_en/OurProducts/ConsumerProducts/index.htm. There you can see the Tego and so on.

Since I am out of the UK until June I won’t be able to have further adjustments till then. At that point I’m hoping my hospital, the Royal National Throat, Ear and Nose Hospital will have their new error-free REM machine.

John