New member, getting first HA, seeking opinions Oticon, ReSound

Hearing Aids
,
#131

When you’re streaming a phone call or audio, and a notification comes up, I guess it’s sent separately over Bluetooth, rather than in the current stream. But I don’t understand why this has to trigger the hearing aid program changes and accompanying beeps and delays. The Phone Clip+ could just send it to the aids, perhaps preceded by a short attention tone signaling a notification.

Meanwhile, the ReSound aids are able to switch to and from the streaming program without any program change beeps; that’s how they work when connected to iPhone. The question is why ReSound chose not to do it that way with the Phone Clip+.

#132

The phone clip+ doesn’t send any other tones once it has connected (an active connection). It just sends sounds from the source.

It does have a pretty short attention span, so if you were doing something that generated a beep every 10 seconds it would chime when it connects, by then the beep is over, it doesn’t hear anything else, and ends the active connection. This takes 2-4 seconds. Then, the next tone from the source is produced, and the phone clip+ goes through the process again. This is what is so annoying.

If you are on a call you don’t keep getting the active connection start chime for every other sound produced. You just get the sound from the source. If it is producing the active connection start chime while already connected, that is not it’s normal behavior. That would be a defect in the phone clip or the phone.

#133

I found the beep notifications on my Forte 8s to be way too loud, and had the audiologist use this setting to turn them down. Better, but they’re still too loud. Will go back for further adjustment.

#134

Bryan9, thanks for confirming my experience. I’ve been poking around in the Smart Fit program and found that setting. I have some others to discuss with my HIS as well. I have a few other niggles, besides the notification interruptions above. Some apps seem to connect to BT and hence the Phone Clip+ does ii’s beep sequences when I do certain things, the Google keyboard is one, when it pops up it triggers the PC+ beep sequence then exists in seconds. I have a banking app, a food tracking app that do the same. I cannot seem to find any setting that will solve this.

The other issue I’m finding is with streaming music, I get digital artifacts, like warble, pretty often. I’ve messed with equalizers in Play Music and in the PC+, no change. In searching, I found that when the PC+ comes up, it uses whatever program you had set, so switching from All Around to Music program solves the worst of this, but it is still there. Playing music, then stopping to hear, i.e. going inside for coffee refill, then starting music again is too fiddly, and I end up in Music program too often, with no noise filtering and feedback suppression, so the sounds can get overwhelming.

I think I am being pushed to get an iPhone. Since I use a smartwatch too, then I need one from Apple as well as the phone. Erk! Though it might solve some of my issues, maybe I will get one later this week,

I also had a demanding experience outdoors yesterday, but not enough time right now to explain it. Just found out what the HAs were like in gale force winds, 34–47 knots (39–54 miles/hour)! More later.

1 Like
#135

None too gently! I’ve got my Forte 8s hooked up to my iPhone 6, and haven’t experienced the artifacts or beep sequences you described. I think the existing hearing aid-Android links are a collection of hacks, necessary in the absence of an open protocol and liable to performance quirks. That’s going to change soon, of course, but I suspect you’ll be a lot happier connecting your Forte8s to an iPhone.

#136

I have a two week adjustment this coming Friday, and I’ll likely pick up an iPhone 8+ to try and see, I’m tall, big hands, not the best eyesight, so big phone with big screens are my choice. I had an iPod years ago and just did not like the Apple design, but I want function, and the Android phone with the Phone Clip+ dongle is driving me stark raving crazy. I had no idea it would be this much of a P.I.T.A.

Yesterday was a trail runners conference leading up to a 50k trail race today. I volunteer with a group that designs, builds, and maintains dirt trails in various parks owned by City, County, State and Federal governments. We setup a booth at the expo they had during the day. This was held at a County Park that has a golf course, so it was set up on a fairway near the clubhouse. This is a very open area, few trees, none near us, with gale force winds howling around as we talk to people about what we do.

Very high wind noise on the mics of the Forte 8s, even using the Outdoor program with extra wind noise reduction. I was still able to talk to people and hear them ok, of course we all paused conversation with the strong gusts, holding hats, paperwork, bags against the wind. I was surprised and pleased how well the HAs worked in this tough situation. The display tents and banners were flapping like crazy, the display tents that are just a frame with a canopy were squeaking constantly with the wind. I was able to talk with people, no problems understanding.

The digital warble artifacts that I have become more aware of now, not just streaming from the phone, but also from the TV that has some decent speakers with a subwoofer, not cheap tinny sound. And even from sounds of dishes, silverware, pots and pans, just on the fringe of the sound, but more noticeable day by day. Overall I am very happy with how they work outside that, but that is why there is an adjustment appointment scheduled for two weeks after I got the HAs.

There is an outdoor concert tomorrow at the downtown mission plaza tomorrow, my first live music event! I’ll see how this handles music and a crowd.

1 Like
#137

Thanks for the great info. Days that I don’t go to the gym, I usually go on long 4 or 5 mile walks while listening to podcasts. Sometimes it’s quite windy so I am quite curious to learn about how any brand HA handles 25 to 35 mph wind gusts. The clarity of streaming will also be important to me, too, because besides any wind noise, all sorts of other background noises, e.g., planes, copters in the air, dogs barking, shoes padding on street, jacket rustling as arms swing back and forth, keys jingling on belt loop, all make it harder for me without HA correction yet to understand what’s being said in a podcast. So I’m hoping the right HA (with the right type of phone BT) will have great warble-free streaming and help cancel out some of the background noise as well. As it is, I’m cranking up the volume of what I’m listening to a bit too much (get the Android sound level/hearing loss warning and back off a volume level or so). So hopefully, the right HA’s will actually help spare whatever hearing I’m risking with my current podcast listening/strolling habits. (BTW, I find wearing AKG earbuds gives clearer speech sounds than Sony or Bose headphones, wind and all - although earbuds are supposed to let in more background noise than headphones?! - By running the Android Hearing Test app, the AKG’s seem to have more output in the higher range frequencies where my uncorrected hearing acuity is lacking than the Bose and Sony headphones do so maybe that explains my curious improved clarity result with earbuds vs headphones)

Besides the wind and walking noises, the other major type of noise I want to find out how to deal with is power tools. I have a few tools for which I now wear both ear plugs PLUS gun muffs over my ears and I’ll go out in 90 to 100 deg F weather. So I’m interested in what one does with HA’s in extremely noisy environments and how the HA’s will take being enclosed in a 100% humidity environment with ear muffs over them. If there is a great thread here on noise protection while wearing HA’s, maybe somebody could point me in the right direction. TIA! And if you are a power tool user, TJ, I’d love to hear how you deal with your ReSound Forte’s and wearing ear protection.

P.S. It occurs to me, too, perhaps in certain power tool situations with the ear occlusion required, there is no point in wearing HA’s and just taking them out for the duration of tool use might be the best solution.

UPDATE I found these two “oldie but goodie” threads for starters on HA’s and power tool noise. Will have to check out some more threads.

Active noise cancelling headphones (some conclude ear muffs best)

1 Like
#138

Jim, I am no longer a power tool user, though I may use them again with the volunteer group. In the spring we do brushing with power hedgers, and some work with a chainsaw, often use a powered wheelbarrow (known as a Georgia buggy too). It has been four years since I have done any of that, and it was always with ear muffs, usually the ones attached to a hard hat that Husqvarna makes. My health issues the last four years have kept me off the trails, but I hope that changes.

I also walk distance often, I average 5 miles a day easily. I no longer have a vehicle, and walk to coffee, shopping, errands, etc., then ride the bus home when necessary. It is often breezy here in the afternoons at least, and sometimes quite windy, like the event I mentioned. So far the HAs have been very good, I occasionally am aware of the wind hitting the mics, but nothing annoying and it is brief, less than a second. During Saturdays strong winds,I would hear the aids momentarily mute when I turned my back to the strong wind.

Prior to the HAs, I always used ear buds of some kind, Jaybirds, then I got the Nuheara IQBuds Boost model that uses the older NAL/NL2 fitting formula. They have an app that does the tone beeps to tune the earbuds for ones hearing. They also process normal sound or you can stream music and mute the mics, or mix music and world sound. They have some noise reduction and directionality features via the app as well. If my hearing loss was mild to moderate, they would work fine for me at $500 USD.

Now I’m trying to work out a system to stream music or podcasts from my phone when walking. The lack of bass is the biggest obstacle, and attempts to boost it give me digital sound warbling. I’m considering full headphones that are noise cancelling as well, hoping I can wear them over the aids, and remove when I need to hear better or converse, shop, order more coffee. I need to work our some of the niggles that I have as an Android user first, then on to better music.

ReSound just updated their Android app today, got me excited with the mentioned improvements:

WHAT’S NEW

• Support for rechargeable hearing aids
• Instant notifications and audio from any app without interruption and without program changes in the hearing aid
• Improved Individual volume control of surroundings, audio streaming and Tinnitus Manager
• Improved interface for Tinnitus Manager
• Minor bug fixes and improvements

Updated
September 3, 2018

Alas, that second bullet “without interruption” is not true, I still get the 2-4 second interruptions and numerous tones and beeps. Ah well, it looks like an iPhone is in my future. I am on Google Project Fi with an eSIM in my Pixel 2 XL, so I need to change service first before I try an iPhone, since Project Fi will not work with Apple phones. Still trying to sort out all the options.

1 Like
#139

I wonder if you need a firmware update in your aids. Might want to make a quick call to your audi.

#140

I have an appointment this Friday for my first adjustment, I have that question on my long list of bullet points to discuss. This guy is so good, I trust he checked them before delivery, but will verify. I was able to check the Phone Clip+ for updates with the Smart Fit software, but no way to do it with aids, even if I had the hardware, since the Forte 8 for Costco is locked.

It seems that this is just the Android bluetooth situation to need the Phone Clip+ dongle that does BT phone to PC+ then the 2.4Ghz link PC+ to aids. The Apple MFI feature can make me overlook a lot of what I do not like about Apple. Also I have investigated that the majority of apps I use have iPhone versions, even the Google apps, so I will Googleize my iPhone if it comes to that. :eyes:

#141

This feature is only available with ReSound LiNX Quattro. There’s no longer any audio delay when streaming begins because the hearing aid does not change to a special streaming program. So you won’t miss the first words of a phone call or the first directions from a navigation app.

1 Like
#142

Thank you, suspected that might be it. It was not clear from the update or the entire listing in the Google Play Store. I just have to be patient and see if and where I can get those from a clinic I can work with, or hope against hope, Costco.

#143

Thanks for more great tips! I think that I will just soldier on with my AKG earbuds waiting for all the big-name brands to come up with their version of “Made For Android” and if you do get a chance to check out the ReSound Quattro’s, I will be looking forward to your comparative review of whether they’re worth the extra bucks over whatever ReSound model is selling at Costco by the time “Made for Android” HA’s are commonly available - hopefully by next spring or early summer, if not before. Don’t know how easy it is to change out domes but I guess if I wanted hearing readily available but wanted some extra blocking to go with ear muffs, I could always switch to closed domes when using power tools and turn the HA’s on and off as needed but I should imagine that a closed dome offers very little noise blocking in the ear as opposed to an ear plug.

#144

I had my first adjustment at Costco yesterday, two weeks after first fit. Thanks to the fact that Collin, the HIS is a great listener and obviously knows the ReSound software and accessories well, he solved about 95% of the issues I had with streaming music via the Phone Clip+.

The PC+ can be tuned in Smart Fit with most of the features of the various HA programs. He set mine with the same settings as my HA Music program, minimal compression, feedback, etc., turned down the mic HA gain, added bass boost. This solved the warble issue I had. This will also be the same with phone calls as music, but we discussed this and neither of us could see why the settings would not work as well for phone calls as music.

With bass domes, my music is acceptable, since classical, jazz, blues, and other acoustic music is what I play most when streaming. One other benefit is I can mute the HA mics while streaming music, and when I stop music to hear, then the normal HA program is not muted, saving steps that were frustrating, I’m giving serious thought to some over ear headphones that will cover the HAs, and try with the open domes that my fitting suggests, with my low frequency hearing still good. That would mean that the PC+ would only be for phone calls.

He also turned down the HA bong tones to minimum loudness for now. After looking at it more thoroughly, there are many sounds that can be turned off. We turned off Streaming Notification, Wireless Notifications, and Wireless Disconnections, and now I get no interruptions while streaming and I can turn my sound notifications back on. While streaming they sound normal, the way they work without HAs active. If not streaming, I still get the 2-4 second interruptions, I’ve turned off sound on most, keeping vibrate, and left four essential apps to insure timely notifications, so if the phone is not on my body, the interruption is acceptable, given the importance.

I had some lesser points to go over, but we ran out of time. I booked a second adjustment, but they are so busy it had to be 4 weeks out, so we booked a third adjustment 2 weeks beyond that date. I’m very satisfied at this point with the Forte 8 HAs, and may not need the third adjustment appointment. Knowing I can get a quick emergency appointment in a few days if needed, the long 180 day trial period, the 36 month warranty, and the fact that it sounds like I will not need to buy domes, or normal replacement items is nice.

I’m also pleased and surprised with battery life with the 13 size. Seven days after I got the HAs, I had the event in the wind, so I inserted new batts that morning, not wanting to do it outside during an event as a new user. Those 2nd set of batts are now on day 9, too bad the Smart 3D app does not show batt level like the Starkey and Widex I demoed. I’m comfortable with batt changes on the go now. After my adjustment yesterday, I got coffee at the outside food court at Costco, and changed from open to bass domes to test the Phone Clip+ changes, that is why I’m confident on batt changes anywhere.

My interest is getting an iPhone has lessened now. The Apple event is Sept. 12th, and the Google event is Oct. 9th. Seeing the prices pop up on the ReSound Quattro with direct Android support, then the iPhone might be the more sensible choice for the next 3-4 years, rather than my current Pixel 2 XL and new HAs. I will wait and see what new features and phones are announced between now and mid-October.

Thank you again for all the comments and suggestions from when I started this thread. The suggestions to try Costo turned out excellent, thanks to the fact that I was lucky to get an exceptional Hearing Instrument Specialist.

2 Likes
#145

Thanks for the update. Does your Smart 3D app have a Status button at the bottom? If so, that may provide battery status.

#146

Did you ever see battery level less than 100% on Starkey and Widex? Zinc-air batteries have a constant voltage until they’re nearly discharged, so charge state can’t be determined from voltage. The iPhone Batteries widget shows phone and hearing aid battery level, and I almost always see my ReSound hearing aid batteries at 100% charge. I saw less than 100% once when I looked after I heard the low-battery tones.

2 Likes
#147

Concur. Although battery meters for hearing aids sound good, they’re largely useless.

#148

bobd, Yes there is a status tab, but I can figure out before looking at it what it will tell me.
The Google Play Store description seems to imply it might show low battery status, though that may well be my wishful reading misinterpretation. :slight_smile:

It is a yes / no connection status.

Screenshot_20180908-112501
Screenshot_20180908-112501.jpg1440×2880 310 KB
Screenshot_20180908-112421
Screenshot_20180908-112421.jpg1440×2880 343 KB

x475aws & MDB, As a former cell phone tech and all round geek, I understand linear vs algorithmic battery discharge curves, and still use Battery University frequently, it has been my go to for 15 years or more. It will give me a few hours warning I found with the Starkey at least. One morning it showed 80% and four hours later I got he low battery warning, The Widex never got low battery, they were likely almost full when I got them for the 3 day demo.

I understand the limitations of a battery meter for zinc air batts, it is not linear like a car gas gauge, but once one learns the limitations, the info proved can be useful. I just want more info rather than less, unapologetic geek that I am. :crazy_face:

#149

Just to make clear how misleading the battery gauge is: Assume you get 100 hours out of a battery, and that the low battery warning means the battery is effectively drained. Then, when it showed 80% battery remaining, there was really 4% remaining.

#150

My first set of 13 batteries went 8 days, I changed them start of 9th day for the outdoor event, not wanting to do it 1st time outside. Second set gave me the warning today, 10 1/2 days of use, About 16-18 hours in ear each day, and 4-5 hours streaming each day. I’m impressed!

Screenshot_20180910-161823
Screenshot_20180910-161823.jpg1440×2880 327 KB

Had an odd one yesterday, split hearing. :astonished:
One ear on Phone Clip+, one ear on Outdoor program that I was on before I started streaming. Still music in both ears when this happened an hour into streaming music from phone via PC+ to HAs. I had to turn HAs off to reset this snafu. Tried stopping streaming, turned off PC+, nothing cleared it until I rebooted the HAs. I’m blaming the Phone Clip+.

Screenshot_20180910-075320
Screenshot_20180910-075320.jpg1440×2880 402 KB

Stay tuned for more adventures… :eyes: