#124

Telephone support works for only a limited range of problems. The solution usually is to go back to your vendor - or with Costco (and perhaps with other chains), to a local store. Problem solving usually requires changing something in the aids, and that requires hands-on by Costco or their supplier. I’ve always found Costcos wherever I find myself to be very responsive to problems over my almost 14 years using their HAs; the service I’ve had is the same in Boston, Springfield (MA), CT that I get at my home Costco in IL…

If you want disposables, I would not go with 312s; they don’t last long enough. I initially bought Jabra EP10s as rechargeable units. Then, on a trip, I misplaced my recharger and had to go without the aids for some hours until I reminded myself that all my travel bags and the charger were black and looked again and found the charger.

It would have been easy to buy a new charger, but I’d have had to wait 2 weeks from either Costco or a local practice.

I went to EP10s with the 13 battery and get 8-14 days with Kirkland batteries. In retrospect, the rechargeables were fine, able to go 14-16 hours with something left over in the batteries, but … although I have difficulty replacing the 13s, I think I’m better off with them than I would be with rechargeables.

I like the 9040s a little better than the EP 10s, but ReSound/Jabra sells the Multi-Mic, which is immensely useful in meetings, restaurants, etc., so I stayed with the 10s. The Multi Mic probably is not as good as the Roger mics, but it’s way less costly. I’ve never tried the EP20s, but my guess is they’re a step up from the 10s, and it could easily be better than the 9040s, being newer. But you need to satidy your ears, not mine. :slightly_smiling_face:

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#125

Depth of discharge and temperature of use make a big difference in the lifespan of Li-ion batteries. Since Li-ion batteries for EVs are super-expensive, many EV owners consider that in how they charge their vehicles and the vehicles themselves usually have a battery management system (BMS) that helps guard against problems, e.g., keeping the battery warm enough in frigid climates or keeping it cool enough in searing hot climates.

Hearing aid manufacturers may consider planned obsolescence with rechargeables, e.g., the batteries only need to last three years because we expect you to buy new ones again after that… But just like Apple advertises for the TLC of an iPhone, you can probably make your HA rechargeable batteries last longer by not plopping them in the charger and letting them sit most of the night charged to 100% (Apple has a scheme for charging an iPhone to 80% overnight and then going to 100% just before you wake up and start using your device). If you can afford to do it (like me, an old retiree mostly at home), not charging to 100% could potentially add severalfold to the lifespan and performance of a Li-ion battery. With my rechargeable Quattros, I would stay between ~35% and ~70% SOC and could get through the day with only recharging briefly 1x during the day. However, for the replacement under warranty, somehow through my audi, I got replacements that did not have brand-new rechargeable battery performance. Even after sending the initial replacements back, I got another set of replacements with less-than-new performance. So I got my Omnias with size 13 disposable batteries, planning, as another poster suggested above, to keep those as “permanent” spares when I buy future rechargeables at Costco. With size 13 batteries, my Omnias will easily run about 10 to 12 days before a battery change - but I can never know when they will run out. I like the rechargeables for always knowing that you have enough charge to get through the day, seeing when you’re running low, and having plenty of time to spare when you get a low battery warning. I’ve saved all my used size 13 batteries, and even for just a year, it’s a massive waste of material compared to the size and mass of two little hearing aids. Hopefully, the economics of EV batteries will drive massive improvements in rechargeable battery technology. And HA OEMs could build a better BMS for HAs, doing like Apple does, holding off on charging to 100% until you’re about to put the HAs in for a day or letting you program the charger to charge to less than 100% if you don’t need all of that charge to get through the day.

Another thing EV battery technology does that HA OEMs should emulate, if they don’t already, is provide a capacity buffer above and below the fake 100% and 0% charge levels to protect the Li-ion battery. When I charge my EV, 100% on the truck dashboard is not a true 100% charge but closer to 90% because charging a Li-ion battery to 100% and leaving it there for considerable periods is bad, as is completely discharging it. So EVs try not to let you do either. Hope it’s the same for HA OEMs…

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#126

Thank you for mentioning this. As also discussed in another thread recently, the new-batteries-under-warranty thing seems to be an article of faith, not a written commitment.

You know that they won’t run out if you change them every 10th morning.

At one pair of batteries every 10th day, you’ll use ~73 batteries per year. The picture below shows a 60-battery box of size 13 batteries (which happens to contain only 36 batteries, so imagine the empty space filled with 24 more batteries, as 4 cards of 6 batteries each). It’s sitting on a $20 bill, for size reference and also cost reference, since this box costs a little less than $20, completely filled. Add a fraction of this box to get 72 batteries. IMO not much waste or cost, for batteries that power a bodily prosthesis for a year without the need for any supporting equipment. And some of the packaging is recyclable.

Let me add one thing for new hearing aid users. Hearing aid batteries of a given brand cost the same, no matter whether they’re size 10, 312, 13 or 625, even though larger batteries hold more energy and will run longer, all things being equal. Since 312’s have roughly half the capacity of 13’s, figure that they’ll cost twice as much per year as 13’s. But larger batteries mean a larger hearing aid and, these days especially, if you want a conventional battery aid you may have to settle for the one size of battery that’s available for a given model.

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#127

So, you have to keep track of every 10th morning. If you forget to make a note, set a reminder, you’re back in the dark for the run of that battery. Imagine a nursing care facility where the attendants have to track “the 10th morning” of every HA-wearing patient and know when to change them out - especially if patients are using different brands, different batteries, different hearing losses (which affects runtime between battery changes). Whereas rechargeables, you just put the patient’s HAs in the charger each night.

On the waste, pennies make dollars. If you have a world in which 100 million to 500 million people are wearing HAs and generating disposable battery waste, it’s just so much more landfill required unless the material could truly be recycled. The EU is more restricted on landfills than the good ol’ U.S., so as with many other things in the public sphere (privacy and full disclosure, cookie settings, etc.), they’re leading the way, and the U.S. is (barely) following…, e.g., GDPR.

#128

If you use Google Calendar already and don’t want to clutter your calendar with an event and reminder repeating every 10 days, then create another calendar to hold that event, and don’t display it. If you don’t use Google Calendar, start using it for this purpose only. You just have to act on the reminder, not set a new reminder on each battery change. I assume you could come up with similar solutions for calendars other than Google’s.

Nursing care facilities have to track individual medical needs for their patients…medications on different schedules, treatments, providers, whatever. Hopefully they can handle a battery change every nth day.

Since you’ve chosen nursing homes as an example, an HA charger could disappear in a place like that. They can’t always be replaced quickly or cheaply.

It’s hard to have a discussion like this without veering into politics, and I think that wouldn’t be good for the forum.

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#129

I don’t think it’s politics. It’s basic physics that you can’t get around. The world is a finite place. Even my neighbor, who’s very conservative (doesn’t believe in global warming), says the world’s fundamental problem is “there’s too many of us.” Supposedly, the world only has resources to support from 1 to 2 billion people in the American/European lifestyle, and we’re over 8 billion now and counting. So, even though hearing aids are small potatoes compared to other resource-intensive things, I doubt HA OEMs will escape the pressure to economize on the resources they consume. One could say HAs are medical devices, and that justifies special, extra expenditure, but the consumption of medical resources is under tremendous economic pressure, too, if anyone hasn’t noticed recently. The advantage of rechargeable batteries is they’re reusable; the disadvantage is that the battery technology is suboptimal in terms of runtime and durability (long-term lifespan). Hopefully, someone will find a way to turn suboptimal into optimal…

#130

Let’s not forget that battery technology will improve. They’ll get denser and last longer between charging. Manufacturers may find ways to make them user-replaceable. When that happens, even a Luddite like me is likely to grab the benefits of rechargeables…

#131

You may well be right. It’s indisputable IMO that hearing aids may be affected by waste management concerns. Whether and how they should be affected is where it gets controversial and political.

#132

I got my Jabra hearing aids at Costco on January 26. When they first set them up I was able to hear podcasts from my phone really well. Then a couple of days later they were so quiet I could barely hear them.

I went back to Costco and they started over again from scratch setting them up for me. It worked fine for a couple of days, but now I can barely hear podcasts and listening to other people is really no better than no hearing aid. I know they are turned on and working because when I run my finger on the piece above my ear, I hear a scratchy sound.

#133

A first thought/guess is that this could have something to do with how your HAs independently switch between their program settings. The theory is that HAs are smart enough to automatically switch settings to optimize for different environments, but of course theory and practice are different :).

When I initially got Jabras on trial last fall, Costco set up with me several different programs that all appeared in my Jabra app - i.e normal (general use), restaurant, TV streamer, phone streamer, etc. HAs should automatically switch to the right program in different environments. I’m remembering that when streaming audiobooks while walking the dog, I would need to use the app to manually switch to the streaming program, otherwise I couldn’t hear audio. Streaming indoors, or in the car switched automatically just fine. I think something with outdoor environment (perhaps wind?) disrupted the Jabra auto program change part … but that’s only a guess.

Phonak Lumitys I’m currently wearing also automatically adapt to environment I’m in. I can switch programs manually but the Phonak Autosense capability works surprisingly well. However, when I’m streaming with Phone or TV, I absolutely can’t hear my wife talking when she’s sitting next to me. My guess is that HA microphones are reduced or turned off when streaming, which could explain that.

So if your Jabra HAs pick up an incorrect program setting it can disrupt streaming volume, or impact microphone sensitivity. This is a long story to suggest that you’ll likely need to return to Costco - your HAs don’t seem to be set up well enough as of yet. There are lots of Jabra users, here on forum also, who don’t have these issues so it would seem to be a setup issue vs a hardware issue this time.

Sounds like the folks at Costco you’ve found in Phoenix are nice and are trying to help. But if you’re just not getting there with current folks, you could also try with a different HA Center at different Costco and see if any difference?

#134

Thanks for the detailed post. I tried every environment available, which isn’t many. Upthread I post screenshots of my phone, but I have only All Around and Hear in Noise. But what I can’t understand is why they work fine for few days and then revert to a useless setting.

#135

We can all related to your aggravation … getting new HAs set up correctly can definitely be a journey with lots of iterations,. But we all want/need to hear as well as possible so lots of us stumble along until we get it right.

With what you’ve said so far about your experience, it seems like you’ve got some fundamental (i.e. substantial) setup challenges … not just tweaks for performance. If I were in your shoes I would start up with a different team at a different Costco and see if “new eyes” on the problem can make any progress with Jabra setup. If not, then this likely takes you to next step - return Jabra, and start over with Phillips. Unless a new Hearing Specialist can resolve with Jabra now, it’s likely not worth any more aggravation to continue with what you’ve got, when there are other good options available.

Lots of comments on this site from users that really like Phillips, so that would seem to be a good option. If you choose this path, it will be interesting to see if you can return Jabra and start up with Phillips while you’re still traveling vs. back home? Keep us posted…

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#136

Thanks again. Upthread I posted that one the right hearing aid died after 8 days and I took it to a different Costco in a different city than the one who set them up the first and second time. When it comes back I will have the Phoenix Costo set them up once again.

I was torn between the Phillips and Costco and may have bet on the wrong horse.

#137

*Phillips and Jabra.

#138

I love the Multi-Mic!! Not sure about any comparison w/ Roger, never having used the latter. But how could anything be better than the Multi-Mic ? and it connects with more, and in more ways, than does the Roger. And as you say, the price difference is about the power of 5. So, for any owner of a ReSound or a Jabra HA, the Multi-Mic is a great asset (in my opinion).

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#139

Having just written in support of the Multi-Mic, I also want to report that I recently got the new “in the ear” 3rd mic for my Jabra EP20s. I can now hear the audio on my Macbook laptop loud and clear without special settings or add-on gadgets!

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#140

I’ve been using the multi mic for a number of years. It allowed me to continue my career as a psychologist (now retired), hearing “low-talkers” when every word is important in my business!*

I first tried Bluetooth tx/rx with wired connection to that pendant worn around the neck, but there was a bit of latency. I used that for a year or two, after adapting somewhat to the lag. When I got ReSound Preza’s and the multi mic, it was a new ballgame. I still use it plugged into my computer for zoom meetings and such, though that may change with Jabra’s, if they connect directly.

  • Me: “Sorry to hear you are getting a divorce.” Client: “No! I said I’m getting a horse!”
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#142

You apparently have open domes. With open domes, the low frequencies will be practically non-existent and you will experience the “tinney” high-pitched sounds you describe. By putting on earphones, you occlude the ear canal and you essentially create a closed dome situation. Then, the low frequencies are supported. You can do the same thing by putting your fingers in your ears, and you will hear the low frequencies return. There is no solution I am aware of short of going to closed domes, which have their own pros and cons.

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#143

You are the first I have found to report the weird discrete audio to left and right on voices. I got Jabra 20’s and have the same experience listening to podcasts. The voice goes from center to separate left and right that are out of sync-like an echo.

#144

I think I figured out the ear switching problem. My previous aids are KS10s which connect through the right hearing aid. Lately I have been wearing pants with a cell phone pocket on the rear side of the pants. I would sometimes get a drop out or 2 when streaming and walking. The Jabras connect to each hearing aid separately. I tried the same path today and tried changing the location of the phone. When in that right pocket I only got sound through the right hearing aid. I put the phone in a front pocket and voila, no glitches for the whole walk.

I hope that solves the problem for both of us. BTW, turning LE on and off made no difference.

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