I’m curious to hear from people who are wearing the latest generation of AI hearing aids: Starkey Edge AI, Phonak Sphere Infinio, or ReSound Vivia.
Do you feel that the AI mode is a real leap forward? Is there a huge difference when you turn it on in noisy situations? Does it really improve speech comprehension? More than non-AI ‘speech in noise’ modes before?
I’m curious because there are some really positive reviews on this site, and other seem to be less impressed.
In general I think AI has the potential to be hugely beneficial for hearing aids, but right now the technology is still new. Everything that’s out there is a 1st generation product. That’s why I’m interested in feedback from people who are actually wearing them.
I tried the Vivia and I’m underwhelmed, but unfortunately it was only for a short period, but I think the first generation from all the major manufacturers is a bit more hype, 2nd gen and so on will be much improved I’m sure.
I have been using Phonak Infinio Sphere for about 6 months. They made a noticeable improvement in noisy environments. i was at an auto dealer showroom with broken AC.so they had the doors open and large fans blowing. I had my back to the doors and was speaking with the salesman. They said they were having trouble hearing me due to the noisy fans. I was having no trouble understanding them and didn’t even realize there were loud fans blowing!
I wear Intents. Definite game changers for me. I won’t say I hear everything in noisy environments but they are a noticeable improvement over the previous generation of non AI hearing aids. Have been able to hear speech clearly in both group and one on one situations where the noise levels have exceeded 70dB. I was in a bar in France two weeks ago where I could hear my brother quite clearly above a live band playing that was at least 90dB. In terms of the clarity it was unprecedented.
@glucas, if you have had a positive experiences with Oticon Intents, then that’s great and good to know. I don’t want to take away from that!
However, I’m wondering whether Oticon’s current ‘AI’ is really on par with the other 3 manufacturers, and that’s why I didn’t include Oticon in my original question. IMHO Intents use the same platform as the Oticon Reals, which are now more than 2 years old. Also, really powerful AI is a drain on the battery, something that every manufacturer acknowledges. Except Oticon. So either they have been way ahead of of everybody else since they introduced the Real platform, or maybe their AI isn’t quite as powerful as the other guys… I suspect it’s the latter…
@tenkan, what exactly made you feel underwhelmed with Vivia?
Are you joking? Oticon were the first to come out with the DNN so I don’t understand your logic. With their experience they should be ahead of the game. Is your assessment based on anecdotal evidence or the marketing hype? On par to the others? I would say probably superior in all aspects other than noise handling to all and in terms of noise only just behind the Infinios.
If it is based on anecdotal evidence then that would be interesting. I must confess I have not seen anything about the Resounds.
So yes, so sorry to sound like a keyboard warrior but there are only 2 manufacturers I would put my house on. Phonak and Oticon.
The marketing men from Starkey all stood around and congratulated themselves that they had invented AI when the Edge came out. But when the south african guy on youtube went into a noisy cafe he found that he was struggling to hear in noise with the Edges, a problem that he was not having with the Sphere infinios. To be fair this may have been a fitting issue with the Edges.
Also, the idea that the AI processing of the Oticons are less powerful because the battery consumption is not as high? You may have a point. But don’t forget that Oticon aids don’t scrub noise in the same way Phonak and others do. So this may require less processing.
We’ll see I guess when the next Oticon release comes out. Perhaps it will be more powerful.
As I said, I think your comment about your experience is valid and a good datapoint. Wanting to hear about experiences like yours is why I started this thread.
Maybe Oticon was ahead of the curve two years ago.
Like @glucas mentioned, Oticon introduced DNN in the More, and refined it with DNN2 in the newer Intent with the Polaris processor.
Their More Sound Intelligence (I know, Marketing, LOL!) has settings for easy & complex environemts, and they introduced a new method of calibrations with their receivers, as well as.
I also only include Oticon, and Phonak as the 1st & 2nd choice.
BTW, the Oticon rechargeable batteries are rated at 24 hrs.
Phonak Sphere 90s were a game changer in noise. I am able to carry on conversations in noisy restaurants which I could not do before. It has been discussed on this forum, however, that the effectiveness in noise is significantly reduced if you wear open domes which allows the noise to bypass the aid and go directly into the ear. Other than the advanced performance in loud noise I have not noticed a significant improvement from my Lumity 90s
Also thanks to @flashb1024 for correcting me regarding Oticon - they did indeed introduce DNN as part of the Polaris platform with their More aids in Jan 2021.
I don’t see any evidence of any significant platform upgrades since then. Just minor tweaks and software improvements. This probably means that a) they have the most experience with AI, and b) they have the oldest and likely least capable HA platform to run it on.
Also worth considering is the fact that 3 of the top 5 HA manufacturers are clustered in Denmark. A small country with only 6M citizens. People working in this industry in Denmark will know each other, and knowledge about new HA technologies and how to implement them will spread quickly.
Oticon DNN 2.0 is on a new Sirius platform and seems to be a significant improvement over DNN 1. You might be interested in reading about it. Oticon Intents include a head movement sensor to help the AI try to understand the user’s listening intentions.
Widex seems to prefer natural sound and has a reputation for music enhancement and is the only manufacturer at this point not to include a DNN.
Good question. Works for me. I don’t like using app so I let it do whatever without interfering and it’s pretty powerful. Phonak Infinio I90. Pulls speech out of noise nicely, and some of it has noticeable digital artifacts. I had 7 yr old Oticons with no digital artifacts. Also couldn’t hear a lot of what was being said. Now I hear speech all the time. Unless I’m listening to music or a movie I don’t care as much about “natural” sound as about hearing what I need to hear in speech. wtolkien is right, AI has a long way to go but for me as an early adopter it’s very nice to have. I tried the Starkey and it was not as good or as clear. So I have the Phonak. As for music and movie–the Phonaks did very well at some recent concerts and movies. No digital artifacts. The settings are ingenious and I don’t play with the app. I spent thousands on HAs and the highly-trained audiologist at Injoy does a great job on my adjustments. So I don’t want to go into a $2 app and make gross global changes a screw up all her good work. And anyway in tech I learned a long time ago if you wait for the improvements and enhancements that’s what you’ll do–wait.
I’ve been wearing the Phonak Sphere 90’s for the last 6 months. The Spheric AI program is truly gaming changing as it finally allows you to hear clearly in extremely noisy place like restaurants, sports events, pubs, etc. These environments have always been the worst case scenario for hearing aid wearers and to be able to finally go to a restaurant, wedding, hockey game, etc without stressing is a huge lifestyle improvement.
There are some caveats. The AI chips chew more power, work best with more closed fittings and are very expensive.
I was interested to read your email as I am trialling Phonak Sphere at the moment.
I am not happy with them and so far don’t think that the ‘A1 mode is a real leap roward’ Today I thought I would try them out on a bus to a shopping mall and it was quite difficult, noise was tinny and harsh. I was under the impression that Phonak Sphere would automatically adjust to noisy situations. In the end I took my hearing aids out and put them back inside the shopping mall. I am not impressed so far but maybe my brain still needs to adjust, as I’ve only had these for 2 weeks… I also seem to be forever re-charging my hearing aids on the phone, and I don’t recall having to do this so often with my previous Phonak aids.
Sorry to be so negative, but at the moment, I really can’t think of anything positive. I’m seeing my audiologist on Thursday so hopefully she can come up with some tweaks.
Did your fitter program a spheric mode program? I’m going to be sure mine have that program (I already have a s-i-l program on my p90s, it should migrate over just fine.)
Put your hearing aids into Spheric manually to give it a good test. You might need the threshold to go into spheric mode lowered.
Surveil what your aids are doing via the MyPhonak app. This is a key to know what they are doing/what they think your sound environment condition is.
I think experienced users are impressed with the spheres and new users are often still having the same old experience of being disappointed in all hearing aids.
I think I have had more ear time with the Sphere’s than just about anyone else on this forum. In fact, I’ve torture tested them in just about every type of noisy environment. Truth is…they work really, really well in noise. Anyone not noticing any kind of improvement in noise is wearing hearing aids that were not setup properly.
They are that good. As are the other AI hearing aids.
An open fit with the spheres is not going to give you the sort of performance in noise that YOUR fit will. A lot of new users just have high-frequency loss. The sphere is a bit of overkill for them and they are still going to have the new-user experience of, “ahh, all these high frequency sounds that I haven’t heard in a decade are sharp and tinny and gross!”
Yes, and then they probably forced the Audi/HIS to decrease the gain of those high frequencies. Then they said, “I can’t understand people properly,” resisting counseling that they should at least try to accustom themselves to that proper gains of HFs.