Experience with Frequency Shifting?


That is why I’m hesitant going to a lower powered aid. My hearing loss slopes, but it’s not a steep slope. Am concerned that any drop in hearing in the mid frequencies might put me into a situation where there was no suitable destination for high frequency shifted sounds. In that case I’d want that extra power for environmental cues. I’m not technically inclined and might not be thinking clearly on this.



Yeah for your case preserving the sounds in the high bandwidth probably wouldn’t help. If anything, you’d want to turn off amplification in the high bands to avoid feedback since very high amplification there can easily cause feedback.

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The basic idea is to figure out how high ampification lets you hear. In your case, I’d guess about 2khz, but there’s no need to guess. An audiologist can do REM and determine MAOF (Maximum Audible Output Frequency. Once you know what that is, then you don’t need to worry how much gain a hearing aid outputs above that frequency. I’m quite confident a Marvel with a P receiver, and likely even a M would be quite adequate for you.

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It is not really something you have to figure out. Your pro will do that. If you get a RIC style hearing aid, the receivers (the wire and speaker) are what is rated (P, SP, etc.) and they can be easily/cheaply swapped out. You can later go from a P to an SP for less than $100/ear.



Agreed. If you have a good audiologist, he/she will figure it out. If you don’t, then put your effort into finding good audiologist.



I have an audiologist who has gone above and beyond to help me in the past, with some aids with which she had no experience, that I had not purchased from her. I know she has a lot of experience with Phonaks, but beyond that don’t know what her thoughts here would be. I’m definitely open to working with her.

I’m going to be seeing her soon for annual testing etc., so will talk with her then. In the meanwhile will read some about the Marvel aids. I know a lot of people on the forum seem to like them - connectivity to one device at a time excepted - but I can’t see that being a concern to me personally. They sound like great aids, and do have direct connectivity with android, which is a nice feature.



This has been a good thread. People with very similar hearing loss involved.
As cvkemp has said, take notes with you to the audiologist. Taking notes of things you want to say helps both you and the audiologist.



MDB is right. At least up here in Ontario, pediatric audiologists tend to be a little bit tighter with verification because they have to be. Both because children cannot report and because pediatric fittings are a bit more regulated. They would be more likely to have experience with verifying frequency lowering.

That being said, if your current audiologist has been going above and beyond in giving you exceptional service, I wouldn’t move away from her just for /s/ verification. Better off just running some listening tests and adjusting to preference.

As for power, I would never suggest someone lower their hearing aid power just to get into a RIC if they are already comfortable in BTEs. Better to have more headroom with less distortion. Opinions may vary on this, but I generally feel that you are more likely to get a perfect, stable, comfortable fit with a BTE than with a RIC or ITE aid.



Interesting. Seems like I’ve seen a trend for RICs to come with more and more powerful receivers. The inherent advantages I see for BTEs are 1) by being bigger they can handle 675 batteries and 2) by keeping the electronics out of the ear, it seems like they could be more reliable. Do they have some other inherent advantages?



Everyone wants a small hearing aid. That has driven small batteries and RIC type aids. There is no reason a 675 battery couldn’t be used in a RIC aid but that would make that aid larger.
BTE aids are simple, easy maintenance and more reliable than most aids.
I’m giving RIC aids a try very soon. Curious to see if the fantastic bass I get from the Naida UP aids will be matched by a RIC.



You’ll have to let us know how a RIC aid compares to your Naida UP.

I’ll be interested in trying a RIC aid if your test is successful.

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Oh, just little things. They stay put. They don’t flop off of your ears and get lost the way RICs can (or cut into the tops of your ears as RIC wires do on some people). A full shell silicone earmold won’t leak low frequencies the way domes will, and the fit is what it is as opposed to the variable insertion depth of domes or sometimes custom canal molds. So once it’s in, the gain at the eardrum stays where I want it to be. There is less insertion difficulty. Someone’s grandma didn’t want RICs on a post around here a few days ago and people were urging her to try them again, but a lot of elderly fingers have trouble even feeling the RIC domes, and a lot of big, heavy man fingers are too big for easy dome insertion. So despite practicing and practicing insertion your patient returns with the domes almost hanging out of their ears and complaining that they aren’t hearing as well as they’d like and they are getting feedback. Then, even if you move to a skeleton lock you struggle with the shell lab to get a nice flush wire fit, and then have to train the patient out of popping in the custom tip and twisting the wire around backwards before tucking it behind their ear resulting in eventual receiver damage. Patients also seem to be able to more easily clean out earmold tubing than RIC filters–I don’t know why that is, frankly, but in my area people have a fair bit of trouble keeping gunk out of their hearing aids and BTEs are a bit less sensitive to gunk.

I mean, RICs are fine. They are good. They just have an extra bit of hassle that BTEs do not. And if you need a high-powered fit, I can’t imagine trading a BTE for the extra hassle of a RIC just so that it is slightly smaller.

But this is all just opinion. There are lots of people who prefer RICs, find them more comfortable and easy to manage. Though, I just recently had two people try BTEs even though they hated the look of them right off and had been used to RICs, and after two weeks of wear came back and decided to stay with the BTEs because once they realized the size didn’t matter they found them more comfortable and they heard better. Hmm.

So, what it actually probably comes down to is that there are people for whom BTEs are really more appropriate who will not accept them and wedge themselves into RICs instead, and then have more difficulty than they should.

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I’m currently wearing RIC - not Phonak aids - with receivers embedded in a custom mold. they were originally sold to me with 60dB receivers which left me exhausted by the end of the day due to having to try so hard to hear. Once those were swapped for 70dB receivers, which also involved casting new molds, they have been a lot better sound quality. They are comfortable and I hear clearly with them. Quality of sound is an individual thing. These do not have that elusive richness of tone that I’d like, but that could possibly be programmed in. I don’t want to mess with these aids any more. It’s been a struggle to finally get them to the point where they are now. I prefer the comfort of RIC to BTE, but I can see where changing wax filters could get to be difficult for aging fingers. It would seem that having the receiver in the ear could potentially deliver clearer sound than having it routed through the tubing of a BTE. The larger batteries of a BTE last longer and are easier to handle for aging fingers.

Will be interested to hear Raudrive’s experience if he gets RIC aids to compare.



I have bought Audeo B90 13 aids. Waiting for power receivers to come in now. They are tiny compared to the Naida V90 UP aids.

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Great to hear! Am looking forward to hearing how those work for you. Hopefully a good experience. You self-program, don’t you?



The very powerful Nadia UP aids taught me I have dead zones that did absolutely no good adding gain to them. My hearing frequencies take much less power to hear. Realizing this and seeing how Don has done well with RIC aids and he has similar hearing loss to mine, why not try RIC aids. The comfort of smaller aids is what got my interest. The Naida aids are big and somewhat heavy. They also push my ears out which is uncomfortable.



I agree that RIC aids are much more comfortable. I suspect I have “dead” zones in the upper frequencies too, and that is something I plan to ask my audiologist when I next see her.

As a longtime wearer of BTE aids I was immediately impressed by the comfort of these RIC aids I currently wear. They fit comfortably, even with eyeglass frames.

Hope these work well for you.

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Oh, I would certainly never suggest that someone switch over to BTEs if RICs are working for them. I would just also not recommend that someone move away from BTEs if they are comfortable with them.



They are working well for me as far as comfort, reliability goes. I am having a lot of problems hearing individual voices, in various situations. That doesn’t seem to fall in any pattern - some men, some women, some kids - it is difficult to describe to an audiologist. I hear but don’t understand some voices. TV - basically rely totally on closed captions. Telephone is doable with some people, impossible with others. I’m not sure how much of this is aids and how much of it is just something I have to work around. These aids seem to be difficult to program for some reason. Three different audiologists and remote programming sessions with people at corporate headquarters over a span of four years. Recently started all over from scratch and had the audiologist do a REM fitting. They are the best they have been at this point. Phone is worse than it’s been but everything else is slightly better. I don’t think they’ll ever work for me, but whether that can be blamed on them being RIC or not I have no idea. I had always worn BTE prior to these aids and had never had this degree of difficulty.




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